Big Brother getting Bigger... again... - 986 Forum - The Community for Porsche Boxster & Cayman Owners

MNBoxster · 08-21-2006, 04:35 PM

Hi,

There is a proposed requirement by the NHTSA that beginning with the 2008 model year, all cars sold in the US contain an EDR (Electronic Data Recorder). These boxes can record any number of realtime variables such as speed and exact position of your Car (through GPS links to your Car's NAV system), whether you signal your turns, wear your seatbelt, etc.

This has the potential for cost-cutting, revenue enhancing States, Counties, and local Municipalities to institute automated ticketing systems for any number of driving infractions.

It will all be presented under the auspices of increasing Public Safety a'la Nonviolators have nothing to worry about, which a majority of the Brain dead Public will eagerly support.

Parts of such a system are already being employed by Car Rental agencies. Soon, Insurance Companies will also use this information in not only settling collision and Injury claims, but also in determining what rates you should pay.

Read more about this very intrusive Privacy issue here: http://autos.aol.com/article/general/v2/_a/whos-watching/20060816150109990001 Be sure to read the article and write to the NHTSA to express your opposition with the link provided in the article...

Happy Motoring!... Jim'99

blue2000s · 08-21-2006, 04:45 PM

Absolutely outragous. George Orwell was just off by a few years, but it's still coming true.

I understand that there is still litigation going on in a case where a car rental agency fined a customer for speeding in a car monitored by GPS.

FIG · 08-21-2006, 10:52 PM

Sounds pretty scary

BentleyJava · 08-22-2006, 05:11 AM

People will find a way to hack it.

According to mine, I'll be driving everywhere at 10mph.

Brucelee · 08-22-2006, 05:44 AM

This is why I am a libertarian.

It starts with a good idea, then ..................!

Perfectlap · 08-22-2006, 06:43 AM

if this is implemented people should be informed that their actions in motor vehicle accidents will be analyzed. This should make people drive safer unless they are stupid and the black box will say that they floored it when the light turned yellow.
Using a seat belt is common sense. If you wish to invoke your right not wear one be my guest. Just don't go flying through my windshield.
and as far as speeding maybe we all need to start driving a little slower if so many of have no idea how to drive our 4 ton SUV at warp speed. I have probably 30X's the driving skill of the average motorist yet it seems like I'm the one always being passed by a 80 pound woman in that 4 ton SUV talking on her cell phone
(I would love for the black box to pickup who is yapping without a head set.)

08-22-2006, 06:47 AM

I have no problem with this proposal.

Maybe it will help track a potential terrorist, stop a car-jacking, recover a stolen car or aid in the rescue of an accident victim or child kidnapping.

I have nothing to hide. Hell, they can put a micro-chip in me if they want!

RandallNeighbour · 08-22-2006, 07:27 AM

Just imagine the hayday the insurance companies will have with this information...

"Dear Sir:

Due to information recorded on your black box, we have determined that it is not in the best interest of our shareholders to insure your Porsche Boxster. The data reflects that you exceeded the speed limit on 219 occurrences in the past 12 months.

Sincerely,

State Farm Insurance Companies"

Sammy · 08-22-2006, 09:27 AM

I guess I'll never own a car newer than 2007... Oh well, I've always been a fan of the late 80's early 90's cars... Probably save me a lot of money to buy cheap older cars.

chows4us · 08-22-2006, 10:58 AM

Who cares?

No GPS, no tracking.

Alarmist crap. See http://www-nrd.nhtsa.dot.gov/edr-site/

Event recording has nothing to do with seeing where your speeding.

Then again, don't the new computers in cars like Porsche and Lotus record every bit of the RPM usage so they can use it as a means to deny warranty coverage? Don't know.

JackG · 08-22-2006, 11:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chows4us

Who cares?

No GPS, no tracking.

Alarmist crap. See http://www-nrd.nhtsa.dot.gov/edr-site/

Event recording has nothing to do with seeing where your speeding.

Then again, don't the new computers in cars like Porsche and Lotus record every bit of the RPM usage so they can use it as a means to deny warranty coverage? Don't know.

It seems you don't know a lot. In it's very basic form, it records your speed for a few moments before you unavoidably T-bone the vehicle that just illegally pulled out in your path. With the data from this EDR, the law tickets you for the accident (because you were doing 4mph over the limit), and the family sues you for the injury/death of their loved one who ran the stop sign/didn't look/was talking on the cell phone/etc.

While the first step of EDR doesn't report your location and speed constantly to your local sherriff's office, it is a significant first step in the process to do so.

Don't think it's possible? Did you ever think you were going to have to check your hair gel before you boarded your next flight?

Grizzly · 08-22-2006, 04:25 PM

[QUOTE=JackG]It seems you don't know a lot. In it's very basic form, it records your speed for a few moments before you unavoidably T-bone the vehicle that just illegally pulled out in your path. With the data from this EDR, the law tickets you for the accident (because you were doing 4mph over the limit), and the family sues you for the injury/death of their loved one who ran the stop sign/didn't look/was talking on the cell phone/etc.[QUOTE]

That's not correct. The boulevard rule takes precedence. Even if you were going 250 miles an hour, backwards, with your lights out, the car that blew the stop sign and entered your path when you had the right of way is at fault...at least in the eyes of the law. I agree that the family could attempt to use the information that you were over the speed limit to sue you for the death, but you would not be cited for the accident.

JackG · 08-22-2006, 04:57 PM

[QUOTE=GrizzlyThat's not correct. The boulevard rule takes precedence. Even if you were going 250 miles an hour, backwards, with your lights out, the car that blew the stop sign and entered your path when you had the right of way is at fault...at least in the eyes of the law. I agree that the family could attempt to use the information that you were over the speed limit to sue you for the death, but you would not be cited for the accident.[/QUOTE]

I was stating what could happen. You sure that'll always be the case? Right now it can't be proven easily or at all if the car having the right-of-way was speeding, but once it can be, things may change. Besides your example, as colorful as it was, is surely not correct. If the law doesn't cite that guy for the accident, we've got bigger problems than black boxes, eh?

After all, the "boulevard rule" fails when the driver in the right fails the sobriety test, right? Is it such a far reach from drinking to speeding? Maybe 4mph over is OK, but 5mph over earns you vehicular manslaughter. Even when it is truly unavoidable no matter if the speed is 55 or 60, and the other person is totally at fault.

Point is, it is a slippery slope, and once we've started down it, there's no going back. Also, you seem to be on the enforcement side of things... is that tainting your opinion? Anything is OK as long as your job is easier?

We still have the right to be judged by our peers... not by some black box without the ability to think or reason. I'll hack or disable it any way I can. I'm sure the big brother "do-gooders" will pass a law against that as well.