Slight problem during oil change, what to do next?
 

Hi,
I am changing my oil on my 99 Boxster (Standard, not an S). I've always changed my own oil but this is my first time on the Boxtster. I used a ramp on the rear driver-side wheel and rolled up that so I can get my drain tub under there. I let it drain for an hour at least and going back to it there's still a slow but constant drip coming out. No problem- without turning the enging on I rolled it down the ramp and got a smaller container under there. Sure enough, a faster drip ensued so I thought ok good, let it drain some more. Waited a while, went back to it, it's time to get the drain plug back on. I couldn't reach so I had to start the engine and I ran it for the 5 seconds it took to back up the ramp. However, in that short time it definitely made a loud grinding noise. In my other cars I would occasionaly have to run the engine just long enough to reposition the car but never heard a grind. I haven't even added the new oil back in yet, figured I'd check with you all and see if there's anything special I need to do here. Do I just add the new oil and hope for the best?

You ran an engine with no oil? Yikes :eek:
That's an incredibly bad thing to do. Maybe you got lucky, but it sounds like you caused some serious damage. Have it towed to a competent mechanic and next time, no matter the car, just use a jack.

^ this.

Or if this was my car, I'd just scan it for faults as 'some' would have certainly registered if a mechanical failure would have occurred. Turn the key/ignition to ON > Scan for faults/code using a generic OBD handscaner.

If no code I'd just fill it with oil and go play!

That noise you heard... it was the ramp moving man, not the IMS

Luck2U

Can't add much to this, starting the engine without oil was a very bad idea. Get it flat bedded to a Porsche mechanic, I would leave the oil out.
Next time don't use ramps, and you won't have any issues getting all of the oil to drain out.

I suspect Fred is right, the sound you heard might have been the ramp moving a bit. That said, holy lapse in judgment, Batman: you started the engine in your Porsche with no oil in it? Yikes. Good luck. The most prudent course has already been identified: flat bed it to a Porsche mechanic.

Just curious, what happen next? I mean what will the mechanic do to identify if the engine is in good shape? Does he have to 'open up' the engine to confirm?

Would a slight misfire not register as fault? Cam sensor, whatever... ? Can these engine really grind/destruct themselves without alarming?

Wow. That is all I can say (and I am biting my lip to keep from saying what I want to say).

If you're sure that it was the engine making the grinding sound, then I'd have it flatbedded to a shop for an eval.

To clarify, the noise was not the ramp, definitely the engine. And again, it ran for less than five seconds, and was not hot.

A shop can use a boroscope to check for damage inside the cylinders.

They can also try slightly rotating the engine by hand to feel and listen for any grinding.

They can also pull the valve covers to check the timing chains.

At this point, be conservative. Flatbed it to a mechanic. You still have a very good chance of driving it away after having it checked but you don't want to take the chance of making anything worse by starting the engine.

Codes? Just take a taxi to your nearest autozone and buy that 9.99 scanner on sale.

Mine does all kind of slapping, ping'ing, tok tok tok sounds each and every time I start it. Was like that when NEW also mind you

Got M1 oil. Some says its the same as not having oil at all

I am hoping that the noise you heard was the hydraulic lifters or some other oil fed component simply running dry and the engine might be ok. But if something really went south, you don't want to start it or you'll be forcing metal into every corner and crevice and machined space in the engine while its running and that would be really bad.

Another point- disregarding the grind noise for the moment, when changing our oil, we all let it drain for a good long time. Then we add the new oil. Then we start it and drive away. Is there any difference when we start our cars in the morning? All the oil has drained into the pan overnight and that's ok.

No. Not the same. The oil has to stay in the cylinders and chains over night, every nights. Otherwise, boom brother

Sorry, tired bud, can't help (I wish). Scan the car

Big difference. In the morning, the engine is only without high pressure oil for a very short moment. Whereas 5 sec's is much, much longer.

As I said, the odds are in your favor, but since you heard something that wasn't normal, the logical thing to to is to have it checked out rather than risk it.

Ouch!

Put the wrench down, and step away from the car....

I've got a durametric, is there anything in particular I should be looking for?

Durawhat? We don't have that here in China so can't confirm what to look for. If it scans for faults, then do that. Don;t run the engine - just twist the key until you see dash lights and then stop loll

Code 666 = engine is dead
Code 777 = engine is good

But do let us know what other fault codes you may find before starting that car. Sure some here knows Durametric better than I do and will chip in

Hopefully not the rod and/or main bearings....

Best I can help with. Under fault tab >

Curious to see what 'grindding' you'll find in there, let us know.

http://www.durametric.com/images/screenshotbig.gif

Durametric scan said no faults, but doesn't the engine need to be running for it to show everything? Obviously I didn't start it...

An absence of codes really means nothing. You are still in the same predicament.

The way I see it, you have two options:
1) Fill the oil and take a risk as is or
2) take it to a mechanic and confess your crime. ;)

Option 1 is not a good choice.

Oh, just put some new oil in it and drive it.

............ ouch next time find a small kid to crawl under there and at least get it finger tight

No. Needs eng running only if you need access to live data. Stored faults can be read with the key removed from the ignition in fact. Mine does anyway.Just not sure about Durametric... better not to take any chances. therefore ignition ON.

So... looks like your car fires at the right time and mix its gas & air properly. Anything you worry about that much that prevents you from running the car with oil? If any gears went 'grinding' in there, surely related to the windshield washer pump. My guess mind you

Disclosure: I know nothing about cars. Everything will be fine as long as it looks good :D

Your call

ps: second hands P engines are $1500 here now, twice less than what labor cost to open your valve covers. Those half-plastic $1500 engines installs in an afternoon with a mate or two also. Cost 4~5 pizza and few beers after.

I'm guessing that's what will end up happening.

One man's opinion. Don't put any oil in it until you jack it back up and pull the sump plate off. Look for shiny bits laying about.

wroom wroom?? we're waiting... we are waiting to find out if we can run those M96 without oil. Tired to change my oil every 2500km... I'd like to extend this maintenance every 15,000 ;)

Slight Problem?????? :eek: Definitely candidate for understatement of eternity!!!

The damage (if any) is done. a boroscope won't tell you anything about main bearing or connecting rod bearing damage.

If this was my car I would put the oil in. Cross my fingers and start it up.

Good luck.

^ this. +1

Pulling the pan will also tell you nothing. The damage if any will be localized and with no oil flow from lack of oil, to move debris, will still be at the point of origin.
At this point the primary concern IMO will be the chain tensioners. With lack of oil pressure they are likely now retracted further than normal. If your cam timing hasn't already slipped, it could slip on restart when there is resistance to rotation from cylinder pressure.
With the skills demonstrated previously I'd recommend a professional look at your engine. BUT in this case the potential damage if any is certainly catastrophic, (main and rod bearings, wrist pins and valves from slipped timing, the Other end of the IMSB ?!?) and I don't see an engine inspection teardown as likely, Then pull the spark plugs, fill with oil and crank the starter for a good minute or two to get oil back where it should be. Hopefully pumping up the tensioners. Reinstall spark plugs, liberally apply Maui Wowee, cross your fingers and hope for the best. Could get lucky.

Sorry, but there is no code for "owner stupidity".........

If there was synthetic oil, wouldn't the residue cover essential surfaces for the small time he ran it without oil?

That residual film is good for maybe a faction of a min. until oil pressure builds up. He started it and tried to drive it back up the ramps, which is way too long to be without both the lubrication and cooling of the oil as the engine was now under a load. Add in that the engine started to make ugly noises, and the prognosis in not good.......

For starters, there are tons of threads and web postings on changing the oil

The car needs to be level to properly drain, not lifting one corner

Debatable. Modern automotive lubricants are designed for very high temp and are thick (effective). You can test/rub two metal parts together for quite a long time! The problem here is the owner had "old oil". Old oil can run-off quite quickly leaving practically nothing to protect metal surfaces.

When load and rpm hits, heats immediately burns off the ineffective oil :/

+1 . :d

Waiting for his reply and some pictures