Need Some Help Deciphering a Blackstone Lab Report

[Chuck W.]

I did my yearly oil change on January 1st and sent off a sample to Blackstone Lab for an oil report. I changed last year from 13 years of Mobil One to Joe Gibbs DT40.

Looking at the report I noted that the magnesium is at 130 whereas the highest previous reading was 24. What do you think? Engine issue or new oil?

[JayG]

2400 miles in a year? You don't drive it much do you.

new oil. Magnesium is a detergent/dispersal agent

Blackstone Labs

It will take 2 oil changes to get all the Mobil1 out

[Gelbster]

High detergent &/or low silicone oils could aggravate an oil foaming problem for the M96. I suggest you need some independent advice on oil selection - for example Bob is the Oil Guy forum.I am not qualified to knock the DT40.
You may find this interesting since it mentions Mobil 1.?
http://986forum.com/forums/performance-technical-chat/55359-hunt-find-best-possible-oil.html
and BTW the expert (not me!) suggests using Caterpillar for UOA not Blackstone - and changing oil more frequently than once/yr.
http://www.empire-cat.com/Parts_and_Services/Service/S_O_S_Fluids_Lab/Engine_Oil_Analysis___Testing.aspx

[Jake Raby]

That report is a joke. Guaranteed that the guy that wrote that hasn't ever built an engine, and probably does';t even own a tool box.

Also, you can't judge any UOA completely without TAN and TBN values. Blackstone is the Walmart or UOA.

[san rensho]

looks like a very good oil report to me, although the viscosity is right at the edge of being too thin, but I always get that on most of my UOAs. I think its just the nature of beast, our cars seem to chew up the oil.

By the way, the M1 seems to give as good a UOA as the Gibbs, but if I were driving hard, I would like the extra zinc and phosphorus of the Gibbs or Red Line.

[Chuck W.]

Originally Posted by san rensho

looks like a very good oil report to me, although......

Thanks for the response and info. It is appreciated.

[Gelbster]

San hints at shear strength/thermal stability. Lake Speed & Jake have emphasized this factor also.
Although I linked the article:
SECTION 1 – MOTOR OIL
I don't want to endorse a particular oil because I am unqualified to do so.
I just think a factual/informational discussion is useful & like to contribute sources,not (my) unqualified opinions.
Many of the competing retail brands are virtually identical yet make different claims. Why 'virtually identical' ? Because there are only a handful of base oil suppliers and an equally small number of additive package formulators. The worrying thing I see in my research work is the Chinese production of very cheap mystery oil additive packages that are finding a market here.
It would be interesting to hear from Lake Speed on the best level of anti-foaming additives in his DT40 for the M96.
This isn't a knock against the M96. Subaru also have band aids to deal with foaming & high-g oil-pick-up starvation:
Subaru Oil System Upgrades - Import Tuner Magazine
I hope this helps.

[Chuck W.]

Originally Posted by Gelbster

I hope this helps.

It does. The more information the easier decisions are. Thanks.

[spendy]

Originally Posted by Chuck W.

I did my yearly oil change on January 1st and sent off a sample to Blackstone Lab for an oil report. I changed last year from 13 years of Mobil One to Joe Gibbs DT40.

Looking at the report I noted that the magnesium is at 130 whereas the highest previous reading was 24. What do you think? Engine issue or new oil?

I've had a couple of blackstone reports done on DT40 in my '98 boxster SPB. Both of them showed magnesium around 150. Based on this, I'd say your change is due to the oil. Also interesting to note that my reports have shown low viscosity (10.4 & 10.8). I see yours are better than mine, but at the low end of spec.

[steved0x]

My magnesium on my last UOA was 127 with DT40 vs 21 with Castrol Edge 5W40, and that was with the first change so there are still traces of the Castrol in there. Could be a DT40 thing.

I am hoping the Silicon goes down when I get the next one done, it is not my air filter, I think when I dropped the sump before the oil change that is the subject of the most recent UOA and cleaned out the snakes of silicon from the previous owner having the valve cover "gasket" replaced I must have stirred up some silicon or else added some when I sealed the sump cover.

[Perfectlap]

Originally Posted by spendy

I've had a couple of blackstone reports done on DT40 in my '98 boxster SPB. Both of them showed magnesium around 150. Based on this, I'd say your change is due to the oil. Also interesting to note that my reports have shown low viscosity (10.4 & 10.8). I see yours are better than mine, but at the low end of spec.

I might be mistaken, but I thought you weren't supposed to track the car with DT40?

[JayG]

I did some checking and Caterpillar does a full UOA for ~$18 as a one off and if you buy 10 is around $13 each. They have offices all over the place, so its pretty likely that there is one of their locations near you. They sell you a kit which includes the bottle, label and shipping or you can just drop it off at the local Cat office

Per Jake Raby and Cat, their testing is much more extensive than Blackstone. Costs less as well

My next oil change I'll do the UOA at Cat

[spendy]

The story on that has changed over the years. The Gibbs web site still shows it as a track day oil, but I'm looking for something else. Not many ?w40 choices out there..

Originally Posted by Perfectlap

I might be mistaken, but I thought you weren't supposed to track the car with DT40?

[steved0x]

Originally Posted by spendy

The story on that has changed over the years. The Gibbs web site still shows it as a track day oil, but I'm looking for something else. Not many ?w40 choices out there..

I've seen that too. I talked with Lake Speed Jr. and he felt that DT40 was an appropriate choice for me, in the green instructed PCA DE group type of sessions.

[Gelbster]

The UOA from Cat or anyone else won't tell you if the oil film is breaking down because of foaming. Foaming is a physical issue ,not chemical. That is why foaming is so difficult to understand and requires both mechanical knowledge of the M96 and tribology to adjust the foaming with additives. Real dry sump flat engines don't have this issue -sigh.
If an M96 fails due to a lubrication problem, how would you know if the cause was lack of shear strength in the oil or just foaming of otherwise 'good' oil? As a foam, oil has negligible shear strength but an unaerated sample of that same oil could show acceptable shear strength.
I suppose you could insert a borescope-camera above the oil level in the sump immediately after engine shut down ?
Alternatively just choose an oil with 'plenty' of silicone and a bare minimum of detergent ? Hopefully people like Lake Speed and Jake will get a well funded R&D contract from a generous oil sponsor to figure it out ! Without such tests to define specific levels in the additive package, it is all mere conjecture to mutter about silicone and detergent.Mea Culpa.