2001 M3 vs 2003 Boxster
 

Posting this poll for a friend of mine

Which would you get, if for the same price for a weekend car?

Option #1:
2001 BMW E46 M3
6-speed manual
127k miles

Option #2:
2003 Boxster (base)
Tiptronic
82k miles

Any German sports car with 127K miles would need some extensive records shown before being considered by itself let alone against another car.
As for the Boxster I had $12-14K in repairs at the 70-90k odometer mark.

p.s.
My 986S has only been a 'weekend car', garage kept for 90+% of its mileage. Still cost me a bundle once major maintenance time rolled around.

p.p.s.
a manual E46 and manual 3.2 Boxster are very close in performance.
A 2.7 Boxster is more on par with a Honda S2000 as far as performance.
The S2000 is the best weekend car as far as bang for the buck/maintenace imho.

If it's just strictly a weekend car, I'd personally go for the boxster even though tip is kinda gross(my .02), but if he's going to be using it as a daily driver/ fun weekend car id go for the m3. As far as higher mileage bimmer's, my summer beater 645ci comin up to 90,xxx and my winter beater is a e39 528i and it's been pretty reliable. It's comin up to 150,xxx and only problem that's popped up was a bad water pump.

Uh, this is a Boxster forum :rolleyes:! I have a BMW (not an M3) and a Boxster, and for a fun car I'd get the Boxster (manual transmission please!), but for longer trips and some practicality, the Bimmer.
I guess all mota just beat me to basically the same opinion.

PPI on both then decide.

Neither. Not fond of BMW's and the Boxster is a tip.

Yeah, neither. Finding a base Boxster with a manual in the same price range shouldn't be tough.

The M3 is an easy winner. The E46 is a classic design and the M3 version only looks better. The M3 has 333hp. The M3 has a manual transmission. The only advantage for the base Boxster is the convertible.

My wife drives a 2002 base E46 and my younger son has a 2001 E46 with the Sport (suspension) package. Both are more reliable and much cheaper to operate/repair than any of my Porsche's.

Boxster because of better reliablity despite being a small amount more exspensive to fix, bmws cost a fortune to maintain too, exspeially with that many miles.


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Too bad they are not dirt cheap like boxsters, I would suggest him looking at an s2000 but he will pay much more up front, save on repairs though.


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I'd do the M3..... a lot more for the money. If the Box was an S with 6MT, it would be different story altogether....

The S2000 hold value pretty well, aren't nearly as expensive to run, are more durable (imho) than German cars and are just as much fun at the Autox/DE.
win, win, win, win.

Wait until the second hand C7's and ZL1 Camaro's get cheap. They'll be unbeatable on all of the above. With a stick stirer instead of Xbox handles.

Haha i agree about the s2000 completly, i just cant afford one in the first place, they do not hold value, they are apreciating... no joke, not at a steady price, rather appreciating, and its because so many are being riced out and destroyed for the purist causeing few good examples left, but it is a very polarizing car, for each one that is riced out and ruined there is one kept in a garage driven by a calm old couple only on weekends with low miles :cheers:. My mother was very very close to buying a s2000 before the economy flopped, wish she would have, on occasions i would possibly prefer it to the boxster. As for your chevy fetish, american crap will always be american crap, weather fast or not haha.

If you are comparing an m3 and a base boxster the m3 beats it in almost every category.

It beats the boxster in many individual areas despite being better in most every way, as a whole the boxster is better, reminds me of this review. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3NlaOS3Vxrg

Ever come out of a store and find someone taking a picture of your M3?

Ever cruise through a small town school zone and hear some kid yell "Hey look, a BMW!"?

Ever had some big mean-looking dude flying his colors on a Harley pull up beside you at a light and say "Nice BMW, man!"?

Didn't think so. ;)

I'm with Mark on this one. BMWs seem to be more for the old boring types :p
Not an exciting car to look at...

I've actually caught people posing for pictures with my car ;)

I once had a guy take exception to my loud headers/exhaust -- he shot me this "there goes the neighborhood" dirty look. He was standing with his cute girlfriend waiting for the valet to bring his car outside of this trendy hotel. He started mocking the Boxster as poor man's Porsche. With my top down I could just hear him a few feet away. As soon as I pulled away two chicks walking over in 4" heels started ooing and ahhing and one took out a camera and started taking pictures of me driving away. LOL. Some poor man's car eh? :D

Tell your friend to decide what flavor of ice cream he likes and then ask which brand is best.

I'm not old (40) nor boring. Having had stick time in both, I can tell you that anyone that wants a true sporting experience would select the e46 M3.

Is your friend more concerned with people noticing him in a convertible, or how the car drives?

I'm putting on my Internet nomex suit now so bring on the flames...

Compared to a to a 2003 base tip, the 2001 e46 M3 has:
More acceleration.
More grip.
Better braking.
Sweet as can be tranny.
Excellent ergonomics.

It represents the best of the best of sport sedans in 2001

I mean no offense to those who've bought a base model tip, but I think that model is kind of confused about what it wants to be. The worst power to weight ratio of any of its siblings mated to a slush box.

If you just want to cruise around with the top down then go get a proper boulevardier like a Merc SL and enjoy a more luxury oriented roadster.

I think my 02 S is somewhat underpowered, but it is still loads of fun in a 6 speed and will outbrake almost anything. Driving it well (smoothly and quickly) is a rewarding experience...because it's not easy; one must get to know the car. Proper launches, upshifts and "heal and toe" downshifts all require finess to perform in satisfactory manner and are infinantly more satisfying than pushing or pulling on a flappy paddle or nudging a selector between + and -.

If one were to take my S and remove 30hp, while adding weight to its midsection, and then give it smaller brakes and take away my ability to physically interact with the power delivery, I dont think I'd drive it very much.

Sorry... Thats just me.

I've driven many roadsters over the years from e-types, Healeys, TR6s, bug-sprites...I cannot imagine any of them being fun as automatics.

Now, if it was a base 5 speed vs an M3 SMG...I'd probably go 986!

I've had a handful of boxsters and this current one is a tiptronic. For everyday driving the Tip is king and surprisingly sporty. For pure weekend blasts I would pick the 5 or 6 speed. I've also had a handful of BMWs the BMW would make a better week end, week day car and I truly believe the BMW is a sporty drivers car. The BMW 6 cylinder is very reliable but not so sure about the SMGs, Out of the SMG cars, I like the ones in the 330i 335i and the 550i. I'm driving a M5 today with a SMG and although the car is powerful I'm not liking the way the SMG feels in daily driving compared to the 330i with SMG.

double post

The E46 is still a great looking car. I'd take the M in a heartbeat over the Boxster.

if it was the same number of miles....

And yes dont knock the porsche tip that much, manual is better, but the auto is nowhere near as bad as many make it out to be, also many of these have never driven with one. I have gotten to know the shift points on mine so well that i can shift perfectly with just my right foot and nothing else still in auto mode. You get used to the degree of angle that the tip calculates for up shifts and down shifts, it is actually fairly exhilarating. Despite this though, when in manual mode the tiptronic is really really impressive for its age, the shifting is quick, about as good as Mercedes paddles from a year or two back. Many many journalist complain about how terribly slow semi autos are on cars of this age, pleauging everything from the smart roadster to Maserati. Many companies are just recently surpassing porsches outdated tiptronic while the pdk simply blows the doors off of most any transmission system out their. It is very nice in traffic to own a tip, and if i had to have an auto i must say the porsche tip is a very very good one.

The M3 has more value, the Boxster will still be more fun to drive. I had a rather amazing experience piloting a students 2003 Tip around a racetrack. A very fun car.

You need to add one more choice. For me it's neither of the two.

The E46 M3's have their own issue as we do with our cars. We have IMS issue and the E46 M3's have Crankshalf or Connecting rods breaking off. BMW did extend their warranty to 100k miles to cover the issue but after 100k it's no longer covered. Affected models are 2000-2003. 2004 or later are not affected.

Base Boxster Tip? I have a 2002 S Tip and it's ok even in manual mode. It's just not as fun. My brother has a 2003 base Tip and it sure could use some power.

lol - The OP has a base with tip. This is a tough crowd.

I've always liked the e46 M3. I probably would hold out for an S with 6 speed. But if I needed a back seat, the M car is a good choice. Although, I think the maintenance on an M with 127K miles will make the Boxster look inexpensive by comparison.


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M3 DD and 986 weekend car. If limited to one car it's M3 all day long!

Also despite the m3s extra doors and back seat, I would imagine insurance to be higher.

Should I have refrained from ringing in? :p

Merely my opinion, but I feel like roadsters are supposed to be true to their design. Porsche designed a small roadster with a rigid chassis, precise steering and firm "ish" suspension. It is supposed to be a sports car. 227hp is plenty to have fun with when mated to a proper gearbox.

Don't get me wrong, I am not against automated manuals or even flappy paddles (I use the buttons on my Lex GS regularly). I also think PDK is a great tool for going fast, it does what I want to do better than I can do it. Still, I prefer a manual because I want to be a better driver, not just have better tech. I have driven the Tip on a base and an S car and it did nothing for me on either, but the base especially needs a close ratio manual because of the lack of low end torque.

If I'm in a small 2 seater, it should be sporty. While the E46 is not a 2 seater it is most definitely sporty.

The 03 boxster base tip is certainly a beautiful and nice car, but a Honda Accord EX of the same year will beat it to 60 and through the quarter.

It's hard to justify the exotic maintenance failures of these cars when a Japanese family sedan will out accelerate them. When was the last time you heard of an Accord engine that grenaded? If the thing has the potential to blow up, at least make it a rocket...

can that isuse be addressed without pulling/splitting the engine?
If not then it's not really an equivalent issue from a second-hand buyer's perspective. IMS is addressed in one day at the shop and has been done by DIY'ers with no experience taking down transmissions.

Uh the comparison is that you get 104HP per liter with an 2001 M3, for that kind of performance I can except that it may be a bit high strung in terms of maintenance.

2003 Boxster Base gives you 83.3 HP per liter (Yawn)...

Let's not pretend the the IMS is the only mode of failure for these engine, because it's not.

I love Porsches and I love Boxsters...but they are long on shortcomings for their performance. The Base tip has all of the shortcomings with the least performance.

PORSCHE: It's all about emotions, not numbers!
You either fall in love or you don't, explaining is pointless.

PORSCHE (e.g. Boxster) vs "any other make (e.g. BMW e46 M3)" = 1:0

just my 2 cents :D

No there's no way to address this other than an engine tear down. This is not an equivalent issue. This is why I vote "Neither".

Sure I indicated earlier that the 3.2 and E46 were similar on the time sheets.

But I don't think I would say that a lowered powered 986 is a yawner.
It's down to the power/weight. The 2.5 for instance has the least power of all but can stick in the mirrors of a base 987 built as many as 12 years later.
With a few weight savings mods, legal in some AX classes, and some sticky tires and you're at ~2,600 lbs. -- striking distance of a 2,550 lb. SpecBoxster that no one thinks is boring.
Obviously these weights are not possible with a tip. But less power alone does not make for a boring ride. For a weekend car, I think a 2.5 can be tricked out to be an extremely fast car.
Street legal R-comps, LSD, some worthwhile mods, and the possibility of dropping as many as 150-200 lbs., I'll take that over a newer (by year) E46 all day.

My BHP per liter analysis was strictly intended to demonstrate the low relative output of our cars for the considerable potential input of maintenance.

104 per liter in a N/A engine is indeed quite a feat. (my wife's Abarth has 114BHP per Liter, but is turboed).

The 78.1BHP per liter of the 3.2 or the 83BHP per litre of the 2.7 or the 80BHP per liter of the 2.5 is downright sad for such a fragile engine. With such "low strung" numbers, it should be more robust.

well de-tuned engine does not mean "go and make the most power you can"...
They're looking for an engine that can survive four years without threatening more expensive Porsches.
I'd say they achieved both goals. Good job Fritz.
But to be honest, that's not the point of a roadster. The emphasis is grip and handling.
The Boxster is the still the only Porsche that converges RWD, low COG, and MID engine handling.
M3 power would be nice but this car sets the bar in its class which the M3 and "other" Porsches can not say.

Neither. ;)

No one buys a boxster for straight line speed simply not what its about :ah: the power arguments are invalid. The question here is does your friend want a high power sport sedan or a well handling roadster, both excel in diffrent areas because they are different kinds of cars. Can you really complain that it takes the same time as a honda accord to do a quarter mile when you get to hear a flat six the whole way their? Can you really complain that you own a car that you can actually drive spiritedly on the road without putting yourself 50 over the speed limit. All while enjoying top down motoring at its best while you hear the engine from the drivers side air intake, as you pass a long white picket fence beside a winding road you hear the engine echo back to you off of each individual fence post, the echo growing faster as you press harder onto the accelerator.:cheers: