Time for new tires - let the debate begin

[BengalsFan]

Boxsitter: In regards to your question which originated this thread, for what it is worth I purchased P-Zero's last year from Tire Rack for my Mercedes "C" based on Tire Rack's ratings, and I love them. Of course, I was looking for an Ultra High Performance All-Season type tire for this car. However for my '01 Boxster "S" I have Tire Rack's highest ranked (Customer Survey) Max Performance summer tire, the Goodyear Eagle F1 GS-D3. These tires came new on my "S" when I purchased it, so I can't compare them with the other tires mentioned, but I can tell you that they have been excellent performers for me so far. I have always enjoyed Tire Rack's reviews and place a lot of confidence in their surveys of various tires.

Ken

[MikenOH]

I f I were living in FL, driving the way you do, I 'd be concerned with, in no particular order:
-Ride quality
-Noise
-Wet weather performance
-Dry weather performance
-Longevity
-Steering response

I would put special attention on wet weather handling, noise and ride quality since you don't track it.

The PS2's and Goodyear GS-D3's I think handle all those issues per tireracks comparisons and reviews. Sounds like the Goodyear may get a bit more tread wear. People in our club that have used the Goodyears gave them rave reviews.

I just put Pirelli P-Zeros on my 98 non-S boxster about 4 months ago. I have been VERY happy with them. FWIW, I do have the 17" sport classic wheels.

Edited to clarify that they are the Rosso's.

[mjw930]

Originally Posted by creseida

I just put Pirelli P-Zeros on my 98 non-S boxster about 4 months ago. I have been VERY happy with them. FWIW, I do have the 17" sport classic wheels.

Just remember that there are multiple variations on the P-Zero tire line. The P-Zero Rosso is the correct max-performance tire for the Boxster. The P-Zero Directional is obsolete and the P-Zero Nero is an all season tire and not what I would consider appropriate for a Porsche.

that's right have had Rosso N1 on my last two boxsters, changed rear ones once a year and had front ones for nearly three years (they needed changing when i sold the car) but i am not as happy with the rosso on the S, quite tail happy, now at the same time weather is crap and they are building a motorway near my home which leaves tons of crap on the roads.
Porsche club Ireland has a deal going with Bridgestone if you are a member you can get 25% off a full set, does Porsche US have something similar?
also i hear often that if you do not use N rated tyres some insurance companies won't insure you! any comments?

[mjw930]

Originally Posted by olly986

that's right have had Rosso N1 on my last two boxsters, changed rear ones once a year and had front ones for nearly three years (they needed changing when i sold the car) but i am not as happy with the rosso on the S, quite tail happy, now at the same time weather is crap and they are building a motorway near my home which leaves tons of crap on the roads.
Porsche club Ireland has a deal going with Bridgestone if you are a member you can get 25% off a full set, does Porsche US have something similar?
also i hear often that if you do not use N rated tyres some insurance companies won't insure you! any comments?

No tire deals where that I've seen linked up with PCA members but some local merchants do give discounts. We have mail order places like Tire Rack that tend to keep our prices low and our local tire stores competitive.

The insurance and warranty issues with non N-Spec tires are a non-US phenomenon since we have laws that prevent PCNA and the insurance industry from being that overbearing. One thing you do need to be careful of is the speed rating of the tire you install if it's not the N-Spec. A smart insurance adjuster can refuse a tire related claim if they can prove you have tires on the car that are rated lower than the OEM tire but I suspect that's a one in a million chance.

I would also agree that an insurance adjustor would even know to look at the performance ratings. When I insured my boxster with a Name Brand insurance company, they were like, "Oh, I've never insured a Porsche before".

[boxstter]

Originally Posted by MikenOH

I f I were living in FL, driving the way you do, I 'd be concerned with, in no particular order:
-Ride quality
-Noise
-Wet weather performance
-Dry weather performance
-Longevity
-Steering response

I would put special attention on wet weather handling, noise and ride quality since you don't track it.

The PS2's and Goodyear GS-D3's I think handle all those issues per tireracks comparisons and reviews. Sounds like the Goodyear may get a bit more tread wear. People in our club that have used the Goodyears gave them rave reviews.

Actually the order is just right. Since I am not tearing up the streets ride and noise are top's on my list. Performance is nice for the occasional on ramp. Longevity - well you just can't expect a lot here. I mean if you get 15k that is probably all that can be expected - you aren't going to get 30k out of these kinds of tires. The Goodyears seem to get rave reviews - except for a couple of BMW track sites that complained about them wearing down wayyyyyy to quickly. Guess I'll see if I can find them local for a reasonable price. Thanks to everyone for the input.

[Chris C Atlanta]

Car and Driver did a test of max performance tires recently (in conjunction w Tire Rack)...the Goodyears, PS2 and Yoko's all performed well. Contis were mushier but surprisingly good numbers wise.

Here's the url...

http://www.caranddriver.com/article.asp?section_id=4&article_id=10252

They offer a lot of subjective opinion and objective info...I found this very helpful.

I love my ps2s (06 987S) and will likely stick with them as I have had good results with Michelins on my Porsches. Had good experience with n-rated Pirelli Rossos on my 993 too...very quiet with exellent wet and dry grip.

N-ratings definitely make a difference. If you look up the specs by tire on TR's site, you can see that the PS2s (for example) in N-sizes are significantly lighter and designed for lighter loads. They are different designs. I too have used non N tires on my performance cars but, as some commented, there is a risk they don't mate well with your suspension/spring rate, etc.

Definitely never mix tires on the same axle, or even from front to rear. Amazing how many times i see "performance" cars with 2 different brands/tread patterns front to rear. Geez.

[boxstter]

Originally Posted by BengalsFan

Boxsitter: In regards to your question which originated this thread, for what it is worth I purchased P-Zero's last year from Tire Rack for my Mercedes "C" based on Tire Rack's ratings, and I love them. Of course, I was looking for an Ultra High Performance All-Season type tire for this car. However for my '01 Boxster "S" I have Tire Rack's highest ranked (Customer Survey) Max Performance summer tire, the Goodyear Eagle F1 GS-D3. These tires came new on my "S" when I purchased it, so I can't compare them with the other tires mentioned, but I can tell you that they have been excellent performers for me so far. I have always enjoyed Tire Rack's reviews and place a lot of confidence in their surveys of various tires.

Ken

I assume you bought your 01 boxster used since these tires were new but I don't see them listed anywhere as an N spec tire. How is the tread wear? Noise? I keep teetering back and forth as to weather an N spec tire will make that much of a difference in ride and performance. None of my other vehicles are performance oriented and generally speaking I just get something middle of the road aka best value for the money for the particular car but with the Boxster I am enjoying the quality of driving so much I don't want to mess things up and at roughly $1000 - $1200 that could be a costly mistake.

[MNBoxster]

Hi,

Reports, Comparisons, etc. can be very helpful, but be sure to realize the Subjective nature of most Tire Satisfaction. Testing is usually done at extremes which few people ever drive to. But even empirical measurements have a Subjective side to them. A Tire running at 15db may be considered quiet by some, noisy by others, etc.

Your Driving Style, Local Roads, Patterns, Habits etc. are fairly unique to you. No one drives Your Car, Your Route, Your Way. Add to this that everyone's Tire Knowledge and Expectations vary widely as well. This is why so often a particular Tire is both Loved by some and Hated by others. Add to this mix the relatively new factor - Aesthetics (Fancy Sidewalls or Agressive Tread Patterns) and it gets even more confusing. For the most detailed Primer on Tires go to: http://www.safercars.gov/Tires/Index.htm .

In other words, buying a particular Tire for the first time is pretty much a Crap Shoot. Only when you buy a Tire again can you have a reasonable expectation of what you're getting...

Happy Motoring!...Jim'99

On the tire issue, tire dealers can be held liable if they knowingly install a tire on a car that is below the minimum speed rating that the manufacturer specifies for that particular model. I know it's asking a lot of a person who's JOB it is to sell tires to actually understand speed ratings but hey, I guess I'm a hard ass.

Just so you know, the correct term is "performance rating".

And you wouldn't believe the number of people who come into a tire shop and drive cars they've dropped $80,000+ on, and they want Toyota Corolla price range tires. No Lie.

And when the good tire places won't sell them Chewy Louies, they get a case of the @$$ and go to BJ's or Walmart and get them there instead, where they really DON'T know what they're doing.

[mjw930]

Originally Posted by creseida

Just so you know, the correct term is "performance rating".

And you wouldn't believe the number of people who come into a tire shop and drive cars they've dropped $80,000+ on, and they want Toyota Corolla price range tires. No Lie.

And when the good tire places won't sell them Chewy Louies, they get a case of the @$$ and go to BJ's or Walmart and get them there instead, where they really DON'T know what they're doing.

Actually the Speed Rating is what it's called and that is what I was referring to BUT, you are right that there is more than just the speed rating that people need to consider when buying tires. Load rating is something that most people have no clue about but again, I would expect a tire "professional" to educate the consumer" (yeah, right!)

It amazes me too that people drop $80K on a car and balk at spending $1000 to replace the tires. Maybe a lot of those people really can't afford the $80K car but due to creative financing then are able to drive cars way beyond their means. That 's the only excuse I can come up with besides stupidity.

Here's a good link that explains speed ratings. http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tiretech/techpage.jsp?techid=35&currentpage=48

Thank you for the correction. I will make sure to tell my husband who is a Performance Application Specialist in the tire industry, that he has been using the incorrect terminology for the past 17 years.

As for getting mileage out of tires, I replaced the original Conti's on my Boxster with 35,000 miles on them. Of course, I kept the car properly alligned, keep the tires balanced and properly inflated and 95% of the driving is "spirited" country road driving, and not much track time.

[mjw930]

Originally Posted by creseida

Thank you for the correction. I will make sure to tell my husband who is a Performance Application Specialist in the tire industry, that he has been using the incorrect terminology for the past 17 years.

As for getting mileage out of tires, I replaced the original Conti's on my Boxster with 35,000 miles on them. Of course, I kept the car properly alligned, keep the tires balanced and properly inflated and 95% of the driving is "spirited" country road driving, and not much track time.

I didn't mean to say your husband was wrong but I checked everywhere I could and the term Performance Rating was never mentioned. I searched all the major tire manufacturer sites as well as the large tire resellers.

Performance Rating, by definition, would include many more factors than simply the speed and load ratings. The problem with something as subjective as a Performance Rating is there isn't an industry or engineering standard by which to measure one brand / model against another. Things like Speed Ratings and Load Ratings are finite and defined the the UTOG thus making it capable of being used accross tire brands / models.

If I'm wrong then please point me to a reference for Performance Rating that explains the way it's calculated as well as the actual ratings themselves.

[BuffaloBoxster]

I have been very happy with my Bridgestone S-03s. They appear to be wearing pretty well, they're nice and sticky, and I don't really notice much more road noise than the Pilot Sports I used to have on the car. They're also a great wet weather tire.

[adg]

Help me here folks........


THis thread is discussing new tires after 12,000 miles.

Is this all I can expect from tires on the Box??? I have an '04 with only 2500 miles now, and expected lower than average (40-50K) mileage, but 12k sounds very low.

Do you guys buy new tires every year?

[MikenOH]

I got 30K out of a set of Michelin MXX3's. Lots of auto-x's on them; the rears were just about to wear bars, the fronts had a bit more tread but the shoulders were gone.

I'm guessing 15-20K would be more reasonable depending on how you drive. The rears will definately wear out before the fronts.

Keep in mind this is based on using maximum performance summer tires rather than some touring tire with a wear rating of 400+.

[MikenOH]

I got 30K out of a set of Michelin MXX3's. Lots of auto-x's on them; the rears were just about to wear bars, the fronts had a bit more tread but the shoulders were gone.

I'm guessing 15-20K would be more reasonable depending on how you drive. The rears will definately wear out before the fronts.

Keep in mind this is based on using maximum performance summer tires rather than some touring tire with a wear rating of 400+.

[TriGem2k]

Originally Posted by adg

Help me here folks........


THis thread is discussing new tires after 12,000 miles.

Is this all I can expect from tires on the Box??? I have an '04 with only 2500 miles now, and expected lower than average (40-50K) mileage, but 12k sounds very low.

Do you guys buy new tires every year?

Really Really depends on the driver....I go through rears about once every 9months. I average about 9k miles a year on the car.