Who HASN'T done the IMS Retrofit (and why not)?
 

There's a lot of talk about who HAS done the LN Retrofit for the IMS issue, but I have yet to find a consolidated list of people who haven't, including their reasoning why. Most of these responses are sprinkled through dozens of other posts and I thought it would be convenient to judge the overall sentiment through a post like this.

I haven't because I'm just holding out until I need a new clutch to save $$ on the labor. I do plan on doing it though.

Is there anyone who doesn't plan on doing it at all!?

Have not; Have had my Boxster for 6 months, and the PPI showed it would probably need a clutch within a year; Like you, I'm waiting for then to get it done. I'll probably just find a convenient time this summer with my independent shop, and get it all done.

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[QUOTE=madmods;283635]Haha sport cars huh!

1) I don't fix what's not broken
2) I don't normally get easily influenced by those in the business of changing parts
3) I follow official reports and figures - in this case they are very low, or still non-existent
4) I couldn't care less even if the car itself would blow up, I'd get another one tomorrow
5) A car is for driving, and life is for living


I've not rebuilt, nor do I lay awake at night worrying about it. Madmods said it best.

This is my 6th summer with my Boxster... I have 70k miles (had 30k when I bought it) and I don't worry about it. I drive it like its supposed to be driven. So far my oil filers are clean of metal debris :) If it happens, it happens... I'll deal with it if and when that time comes. If I need a clutch at any point I would probably do it though...

I am at 86,000 miles in my 2000 Box. Haven't done the IMS and don't plan to anytime soon. I also drive my car like its meant to be driven. Always revving high, turning fast, accelerating as fast as I can each time I drive it. When I did oil change at 80k, the oil filter had no debris.

Plus, I hear the IMS issue is due to maunfacturing tolerances problems. Some were not in the correct tolerances and some were. It's impossible that all Boxsters were effected.

Simple math; I have no interest in working on this car (been there, done a buncha that with previous sportscars.) I would probably use Raby for the job since they're close, and it is appx $3500, or was last year when I checked. That is about 25% of the cost of a new motor. I do not believe there is a 25% chance that any random motor will go. I've owned this 2004 S since new, now have 39k miles, have kept up the oil changes more frequently than factory. Finally, if it goes, it goes. I won't be skipping with joy, but it won't change a thing in my life. Put a new motor in and be done with it.

And there's a good chance I'll trade it on a 981 if I really like them, and the LNE bearing won't bring me anything when I trade. If I decide to keep the 04, I'll wait till a clutch is needed, then install the LN bearing at that time, since the cost goes down dramatically and it statistically beginns to make sense.

unless you're already in there and/or have lots of disposable income.

Im leaving for 9 months so I decided to bite the bullet and have it done since my wife would not know what warning signs to look for or anything. Plus the shop then can point out any other issues they find that might need attention in the future (or immediate) I got a call yesterday and they said my flywheel should be replaced at my next clutch change.

my car was also a candidate for failure (fairly low miles, long oil change intervals at about a year each, infrequently drove during the wet season, its a single row, etc)

Yes I agree 100% with this. I have weakened and had installed the IMS Guardian though. PPI said fine oil mist on rear of engine and bell housing. Is that a ploy to get me to install new RMS, ims job and new clutch while in there? When the Guardian warning goes off , then a new IMS. Otherwise I drive my 2001 Boxster base hard when conditions permit. Good post. Great thoughts.

55K on my car and not planning on doing any repairs on it until it really needs it. As Madmods stated, "don't fix what is not broke." Bought the car new in 2007, change the oil every 5K, and drive it daily.

When I was a 'new' Porsche owner in 2007, this forum scared the hell out of me with all the predictions of IMS failures and water pump replacements, etc. I thought I had spent $70K for a piece of junk that could blow up any minute. Folks were recommeding to fix it now before it breaks. I was worrying all the time and seriously thinking about getting rid of this car and buying something more reliable - maybe Japanese. But, bottom line, those days are gone. I have accepted that this is just a car. It is still running and still being driven daily AND life is for living and not worrying about something that may happen.

Don't fix until it is broke and drive it like it is supposed to be driven.

I have been wondering about this "When the Guardian warning goes off"... doesn't that mean that it's already too late ? Bits of metal floating around in your sump means quite a bit of damage has been done already surely ?

My brother did his clutch 1.5 years ago and has no plans to get in there again unless something breaks. California car, 4k oil chg intervals, filter inspected and always clean.

I needed to replace the clutch and trans on my car last fall so while we were in there...
My old IMS bearing looked to be in very fine shape at 98k miles though.

Have not done it. My car is 2.5L with a tip, never heard problems on that combo with a low mileage. Maybe then I reach 100 000km, I will change a new original style bearing and oils to the tip.

my dual row bearing was in PERFECT condition when it was replaced with the LN IMS.

But I think that's almost irrelvant. If there's a shop that has enough business to go through the time-consuming and expensive process of inventing a contraption that will act as an early warning system, then clearly there is an above normal amount of catastrophic engine problems occurring.

Whether it was a manufacturing flawe or design flawe is also nearly irrelevant to me. The Porsche engineering dudes got their calculations wrong somewhere and then apparently, made things worse after they realized their initial error (single row bearing). Then you find out that you can spend $1,200 to do something about all this and you're still not going to? Personally I would do it with the clutch, even if you're old clutch is still good, and tell yourself you're good for another 100K miles with some engine maintenance as a side benefit.

I am waiting for it to blow so I can get a new engine. Or, I drive it and don't worry as I was advised by a Porsche mechanic.:cheers:

Not until my IMS guardian tells me to..

Yes Terry I understand your question. I think that LN engineering has done enough research to show that the detection of metal buildup is occurring before an actual IMS disintegration. The makers have way better explanations than this layperson. For me it is a form of insurance. When the warning horn/lite goes on pull over asap.

I have spent $2k on my 2001 Boxster last year and assuming nothing goes wrong, I am only spending minimal on real Porsche coolant this year.:)

I bought my 2000 Box S in Feb 06 and it had 60,000 miles. I'm now at 152,xxx. Last year at 142,000 I had to pull the trans to fix the second gear synchros, so I had a nice look at the back of the engine. The RMS had a well established but dry velveting, so I left that alone. The IMS was dry as a bone. 140,000 miles of dirt, but no signs of oil.
With this many miles and five years of hard autocrossing, the engine doesn't owe me anything. When the time comes, she'll be rebuilt to add some serious power, and then I'll do the bearing, along with everything else.

I have had my 97 for 3 years now and it has 82k on the clock. Its a 5 speed and it still feels solid. I drive it daily and I maintain via oil changes and any other necessary repairs. If it goes, it goes and I will then repair it. 3 years of pleasureable driving will not make me change how i feel. Hope it doesnt happen but if it does, then it does.

Early 98 Tip with 75K on the clock. Got it 6 years ago with 24K on the clock. I change the oil about every 4K, do all the fluids at correct intervals and enjoy the h*ll out of the car. As others have said, when I first got the car this forum scared the daylights out of me, but now I drive it, maintain it and don't worry.

Same as everyone else here... 2000S w/41k. Change the oil once a year with usually around 1000 mi. on it. My clutch makes a dreadful squeeeeak noise every time I depress it. I've heard different ideas as to why. A dry something-or-other?? It's coming from inside the trans., not the interior of the car. When it gets bad enough I'll replace the clutch and then probably do the LN upgrade. When I bought the car 4 years ago, just like everyone else...this forum scared me with all the ims chatter. I decided to just enjoy the car and not worry about something that most likely will not happen. I've vowed to start driving the car more. Starting with today I drove it to work. Maybe that pesky clutch squeak will work itself out??

I'm new to the forum as I'm doing research for a possible Boxster purchase in the fall. I've found alot of information regarding this IMS issue. I've spoken with Porsche mechanics in my area as well...My impressions are the defect or whatever you want to call it is real...

I counted 43 listed engine failures on another forum. While many weren't diagnosed because of the cost of teardowns they displayed they same characteristics of an IMS failure...

I really like the Boxster and if I do get one this fall I see a IMS guardian or upgraded bearing as part of the cost.

Seems like a lot of money to spend for something that might happen. Also, the replacement bearings are starting to see some failures. Nothing is guaranteed. I think I will wait until metal particles are found in the oil filter, if ever, and just enjoy driving it.

+1 for Madmods.

The only thing I'd add is that if my IMSB has lasted 104,000 miles, then its likely to last quite a bit longer. My theory is to redline often to splash some fresh oil into the failed IMSB seal!

Remember that there have been over 200,000 Boxsters sold...

I absolutely do not doubt that the IMS bearing is weak point of these engines.

But equally, it's far from clear how frequently they fail. Nor is it clear ow reliable the replacement bearings are. Compared to the original bearings, the installed base on "upgraded" bearings is very young and very tiny.

Moreover, I get the impression that the original bearings tend to go at relatively low miles. With my car now on 100,000 miles, I'm going to assume I've got one of the good bearings. It clearly isn't one of the really bad ones.

2.5s are now so cheap in the UK, it almost makes more sense to just drive it till it breaks, sell it as a rolling chassis and buy another.

98 2.5 has 115k miles, a little late to start worrying...

My 3.6 has just over 50k and I am going to do the Pelican IMS Kit when it becomes available and I rebuild my gearbox. I am 99.9% sure I will be pulling a perfectly good bearing out and replacing it but while I am inches from it it makes sense to do it anyway. If my gearbox did not need rebuilding I would wait at least another year since the engine was just put in the car less than 20k miles ago.

I just can not justify the time to replace it unless I am going to do the clutch. My car has around 120k on the clock and by it's looks it has been driven hard. I am going to keep up the abuse day after day to make sure I am safe.

Boxsters were meant to be driven and driven hard and it seems to be that most of the failures are in lower mileage pampered cars. People seem to believe that the upgrade is the cure all and that is simply not true.

I haven't replaced mine either. I just don't believe anyone has the correct solution to the problem.... yet.

well I have my old bearing sitting next to me, just picked up my car today. The bearing spins way more freely than it should and wobbles if you wiggle the shaft. 66k on it.

Now I like that one! Would make a great poster!

http://986forum.com/forums/performance-technical-chat/33699-boxster-986-complete-suspension-overhaul.html

And all this time I thought you were like me...fix EVERYTHING that is not broken...because it is fun! Just messin with you.

Oh and I'll be giving an update to that thread...since I to developed suspension overhaul fever.

And yes I DID change out my perfectly good IMS double row :)

I haven't upgraded the IMSB in my 2003 S (24k miles). Seems spending $3K + on an insurance policy that you don't know if you need seems pretty steep on a $20,000 car.
If it fails, I'll either sell the dead carcass for a few thousand and never buy another Porsche again, or maybe take advantage of the situation and try to find someone with experience installing a 3.8L 997S engine into it and make it a rocket.
If I ever have the transmission out and am replacing the clutch, I would probably do the IMSB for good measure, just not willing to spend that much for nothing in hope that I'm fixing a problem.

I've got a 99 boxster with two major accidents under it's belt. :rolleyes:
Resale values on old boxsters are low and mine's even lower. If i needed a clutch then I'd spend the extra cash and replace it. For now I'll just do frequent checks on the oil filter with a high power magnet (I pulled out of an old hard drive). :D

^ I like the hard drive magnet idea. Brilliant.

My 2c .. copied and pasted from another thread ..

Vijen6-

I am new to Boxsters, but the Boxster I just purchased, (to build into a Spec Boxster race car), is the 10th or 11th Porsche I've owned over the last 25 years. I don't know why, but Porsche owners always seem to assume the worse, (and seem to have lots of disposable income!), and will do whatever upgrade is the latest and greatest... It was tensioners in early 911's, 20K belt changes in 944's, Cylinder head seals in 964's... and in Boxsters.. IMS's... I've owned all of the above cars+, not done a single one of the must do "upgrades" and have never been caught out... as long as I've done the normal scheduled maintenance. I believe Porsches should be driven hard and put away wet.... They seem to thrive under hard usage...

With respect to the logic in the copied post:

•10% failure rate appears way off... more like 1-3%

•Used motors, at least for early cars are around $2500-3500+perhaps $1K install ,

Although I agree with the conclusion... Don't bother unless you're in their and doing it your self....

My $0.02

-CKKrause

Agreed CK. I thought the 10% number was a bit high but like I said it stuck in my mind reading it somewhere as LN's estimate numbers. IMO LN's site language is a bit of a scare tactic to sell more parts / service .. simply smart business.

And also the $9k engine replacement number is assuming a $6K used S engine on eBay + install rate @ my indi. Your rates may vary if you can get a deal on engine or doing labor yourself.

On a slightly off topic, I'm running LN's oil filter and my indi mechanic has been nudging at me to go back to stock. Maybe separate thread for oil filters ? LOL

Finally, mathematics that justify my personal logic! Viken6 put it better than I've seen, and it casts doubt on the often used phrase "cheap insurance."