911 vs 986/987

[fullthrottle52]

I know this again may be a self answering question but I would like to get other opinions here.
I stopped by a local used car lot today because I saw a real nice looking 911 setting on the lot and said I wanted to scope it out just to see what year, mileage etc.
My question is why are 911's so expensive compared to the boxster. The 911 i looked at was a 2002 base model with 35,000 miles. Very clean but still 10 years old. They wanted $46,000. I said to myself, this car has the same seats, center console, dash, radio, heating system as my boxster. Similar engine with a little more hp. I know they sell new for a whole lot more than a boxster or cayman but used is used. Maybe it's supply and demand but I can't see the difference between a 2002 911 and a 2002 boxster being $25 to 30K. I know we are loyal to our boxsters on this site but how many of you would buy this 911 for $46,000 just to say you drive a 911.

Just opening up for your opinions and comments. Someone convince me to buy this Porsche.

[coreseller]

2002 Base 911 $46k, 2002 Boxster $25 to 30K? I'd say you should do a little more looking. Those prices are way out of line. Kelly Blue Book says that car retail (no options added) should be $30k, I've seen 911's in that range go for low to mid 20's private party. Yes, the 911 will always be more even though it's effectively the same car doors and front seats forward. It's a different model than the Boxster regardless of shared pieces, it will always be held higher in price.

[Topless]

Ask em if they would take $20K for it. $46k is WAY out of line for a 2002 Carrera.

[fullthrottle52]

coreseller,
I was refering to the difference in price for a 2002 boxster (aprox $16,000 and this 911 at $46,000). I have a hard time finding a 2002 911 in excellent condition with 35,000 miles for less then $35,000. I guess this is not the point I was trying to make. I don't get the big difference in pricing?

[Topless]

Originally Posted by fullthrottle52

coreseller,
I was refering to the difference in price for a 2002 boxster (aprox $16,000 and this 911 at $46,000). I have a hard time finding a 2002 911 in excellent condition with 35,000 miles for less then $35,000. I guess this is not the point I was trying to make. I don't get the big difference in pricing?

Dig deeper. Just because a dealer is asking $46K doesn't mean anyone will buy it at that price:
2001 Porsche 911 Carrera, $29,991 - Cars.com

http://www.cars.com/go/search/detail.jsp?tracktype=usedcc&csDlId=&csDgId=&listingId=82734662&listingRecNum=0&criteria=prMx%3D30000%26sf1Dir%3DDESC%26prMn%3D0%2 6mkId%3D20081%26stkTyp%3DU%26mdId%3D20705%26rd%3D5 00%26mlgId%3D28866%26crSrtFlds%3DstkTypId-feedSegId-mkId-mdId-pseudoPrice-mlgId-yrId%26zc%3D91739%26rn%3D0%26PMmt%3D1-1-0%26stkTypId%3D28881%26sf2Dir%3DASC%26sf1Nm%3Dpric e%26yrId%3D20142%26sf2Nm%3Dmiles%26isDealerGroupin g%3Dfalse%26rpp%3D50%26feedSegId%3D28705&aff=gogsema&listType=1

[coreseller]

Originally Posted by fullthrottle52

coreseller,
I was refering to the difference in price for a 2002 boxster (aprox $16,000 and this 911 at $46,000). I have a hard time finding a 2002 911 in excellent condition with 35,000 miles for less then $35,000. I guess this is not the point I was trying to make. I don't get the big difference in pricing?

I followed the 996 market for about 18 months before buying another series 911, from what I remember mid to high $30's got you a low mile, high optioned and pristine C4S private party, base models were $10k (or more) less. Even it being a dealer, $46k for that car you described is frankly laughable. I find it hard to believe you can't find that year / model for much less, I'd dig deeper if I were you.

As far as the difference in pricing goes, like I stated earlier; even though they may share pieces and look alike, the 911 and the Boxster are two distinct models. The Boxster will always be the "entry level" Porsche and the 911 will always be at the top of the hierarchy, at least until they come out with a new model lineup.

Is it worth it? IMO no, but at least as long as there are those who are willing to pay the premium for the 911, the market will dictate and support the higher price. If people wise up and realize the Boxster actually performs the same and even handles and brakes better than the 911, the pricing gap would close but I doubt that would happen.

[fullthrottle52]

corseller,
I agree. I like driving my Boxster and don't think the price difference is worth it. Plus I imagine the maintaince cost are higher than a Box.

Thanks for the input. I don't think this dealer is going to come off this price more than a couple thousand so i will be happy with my Boxster.

[pothole]

It's true that the 911 and Boxster are largely the same car. However, Porsche charges almost twice as much for the former and that's got to be reflected in used values.

The profit margins on the 911 must be spectacular.

[Bmod986]

Well there is a big reason for the 911 to be priced so high and it is largely prestige. The fact that the 911 is the flagship of porsche and largely the embodiment of many years of motoring for porsche makes it a wanted car. Like mentioned in other threads people in the car world view boxsters as nothing special while the 911s are the top of the porsche charts and the people who are not to knowledgable on cars think that the badge itself is prestigious and they wouldn't be able to afford buying and maintaining a porsche. I personally love my boxster but i truly would love to have a 911.

I wouldn't trade my boxster for one but i want both. Also price when new and horsepower are higher in the 911. I just wish porsche would have given the boxster more horsepower. There are times when I want to pull off that light much faster then what I really am able to do. But any way the 911 is just a more desirable car to almost everyone. I have driven both and I like them both but the boxster handles better hands down. As a porsche enthusiast I think that everyone in this forum would have both these cars if they could.

They are quit different when it comes to performance and when I compared the driving experiences there was this feeling that i got that made me feel that both these cars have different purposes. Of course they were both designed as sports cars but the boxster was more of an indulgence rather then a hardcore sports car. And from what I can gather on the internent car market people a prepared to pay more for hardcore sports cars. Just to give you guys an example try to find an M3 E46 for less then 20,000 without going for any salvaged ones.

[fivepointnine]

umm I beg to differ on the performance aspect, I was about to buy a 99 carrera but it felt no faster than my 02 S, and here in the PNW I have yet to see ANY decent 996 below about 22k, most are hovering around the 25-30k range, which would get me a much new Cayman.

for the minimal performance increase (which I did not feel but paper specs says is there) I could not justify paying so much more for a 996. Plus the front half of my car is the same as a Carrera anyway.

I have decided that if I get another P-car to sit next to or replace the S it will be a aircooled 911 or a Cayman S

[j.fro]

In no way do I endorse a 911 over a 986, but there are some base 911 pieces that are "upgrades" over base 986 pieces:
Brakes (base 911 same as 986S)
manual transmission (see above)
rear seats (911 way more comfortable, )
rear suspension
wheels & tires

[fivepointnine]

I was making the comparison between a Carrera and a 986 S...in a base model there is a larger gap

[sasha055]

Carrera is more expensive because it's a Porsche flagman, also 911 may be a "replacement" for a family car, Boxster cannot.
I'm one of those who will trade Boxster for a 911 this summer, I hate it, I love my Boxster and I hate how 911 looks (except 993 and turbos) but the reality is.. I need a 4 seater to drive kids to school, so my option is ... well 911 if I want to stay with Porsche
As much as I love my Boxster it's highly impractical if you have kids
I think a lot of ppl are in my shoes (I know at least one more) that's why 911 will always be more expensive

Sasha

[Perfectlap]

LOL

if they sell that 996 to someone for $45K please ask that person to call me. I have a great deal on a bridge here.


986/987 and 996 Carreras are going to take a big hit this year with the new models coming out. You'll be able to get into a 2002 face-lifted 911 for well under $25K soon.
Even 997 Carreras will be had for under $35K.
Think about it, for under $40K you could have a Boxster S and a mint condition 2002 Carrera.... You can't buy a new high end SUV for that much now. LOL.

Excellence Magazine

[fivepointnine]

I understand that pricing chart from Excellence, but in reality I never see cars for sale as low as they have the prices listed.......Ill use the example I have always used, here in the Seattle area you will NOT find a decent '99 996 for 19k, the ones that are that price are either very high mileage with minor issues or rebuilt titles.

same goes for 986's, I bought probably the cheapest 986 S in the region that was decent from a private owner, haggled for a couple days and bought it for 15.5k, 1k off his asking price, but still above the Excellence chart.

this MAY be a regional thing though, but I check craigslist and autotrader in the area regularly

[Ghostrider 310]

I have looked at a lot of 911 cars and drove a 2011 - 911 . As far as driving, comfort and enjoyment they are nice, I just don't care for the look of the car from the rear. Beyond that, I'm convinced that the mid engine chassis dynamic is superior by inherent design.

[Perfectlap]

Originally Posted by fivepointnine

I understand that pricing chart from Excellence, but in reality I never see cars for sale as low as they have the prices listed.......Ill use the example I have always used, here in the Seattle area you will NOT find a decent '99 996 for 19k, the ones that are that price are either very high mileage with minor issues or rebuilt titles.

same goes for 986's, I bought probably the cheapest 986 S in the region that was decent from a private owner, haggled for a couple days and bought it for 15.5k, 1k off his asking price, but still above the Excellence chart.

this MAY be a regional thing though, but I check craigslist and autotrader in the area regularly

I find Excellence mirrors pricing in "high income" markets pretty well. The resale for the well-maintained Porsches in particular.

Also something I have noticed in looking at the prcing, a well-maintained Boxster did a lot better than a well-maintained 996 Carrera when the economy collapsed.
It seems that second hand buyers were simply not willing to pay above a certain amount for any non-GT Porsche. Those 996 Carreras were dropping about $10-$12K a year on average until the stock market completely bottomed out. Losing a grand a month must have hurt when you're still paying it off.

[jcb986]

Hey Perfectlap, those prices you have there are close KBB, but dealers use a wholesale Black Book to price your car. Those prices can be $3-6K below KBB depending on mileage and condition.

[fullthrottle52]

I want to send out an apology to all. The porsche 911 I looked at was a twin Turbo model.
That $46,000 price makes more sense. I stoped again today and sat in the car. I could not get the seat comfortable for me. It seemed to set higher than my Box and I could not get the seat back as far. My head was just scraping the head liner. I'm 6 ft. even. It is a pristeen one owner car but I would won't purchase because i cant get as comfortable in the car. I can't even see the upper half of the guages because the wheel won't go up any higher. Yes it has electric seats but i had it all the way down.

Sorry for the misinformation.

[amschnellsten]

Now that is a different story, I would trade my 84 Carrera, my Boxster, and throw in a 928 s4 for a 996TT.