IMS facebook webpage against Porsche failure

[kx9862002]

check this out.I just found this link:

http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=113061178726327&v=wall&viewas=0

[kcpaz]

They DID do something... they finally did away with the IMS altogether. In my opinion, they waited about 10 years too long though.

[lifeisgood]

Only 13 members.

[yelojkt]

I wonder where they got their 20% figure from.

[mikefocke]

has been posted on the net before. There has never been any scientific basis for it.

Recall that Porsche went through 3 different designs of the IMS trying for a reliable one before they eliminated it so it isn't fair to say they did nothing till they eliminated it.

20% of any make's engines will fail given enough time and miles. So the interesting figure to me is how many failures per year of driving.

If 400 LN IMSR kits have been sold per year against 200k cars on the road, that is a small number. Considering that some of those kits replace good bearings, some replace about-to-fail bearings, and some go into engines because another engine fails or the engine is being rebuilt...the number is pretty small on an actual failures per car per year basis. I don't know how many engines Porsche rebuilds a year but since the inventory has been said to be in the teens, can't be too many. Add in engines reused from totaled cars. And parted out cars.

And consider many of the cars failed for a different reasons...said to be 21 or 22 of them. And are never opened up so they get lumped into the "must be IMS" pile.



We obsess too much...because we love em.

[Jake Raby]

I don't know why everyone gets so caught up in percentages... To create a percentage thats anywhere near accurate an EXACT production number must be known as well as an exact failure number.. Neither of those can even come close to being calculated..

At any rate, I saw the FB page and it reminded me that I needed to start one for Flat 6, so i am working on that now.. It'll give a good place for us to post updates as they occur and host the pics we want to share quickly.. I'll be uploading pics all damn day now!

[yelojkt]

Originally Posted by Jake Raby

I don't know why everyone gets so caught up in percentages... To create a percentage thats anywhere near accurate an EXACT production number must be known as well as an exact failure number.. Neither of those can even come close to being calculated..

So true. Thus I stated "I wonder where they got their 20% from?" There is no way anyone could possibly know any numbers. But that doesn't stop them from stating it as a matter-of-fact.

[lifeisgood]

Like I've said they only got 13 members on the FB page.

[kx9862002]

true. they only have 13mems

:ah:

[Adam]

20% LOL. I bet it's closer to 2%. Porsche produced about 250,000 986's alone. If it was anywhere near 20% there would be 100 new posts on here everyday from people with actual failures and Porsche would have a serious problem on their hands. And their Facebook page would have a heck of a lot more than 13 members lol. If people are so damned worried about it either sell the car or take it to Raby. It's pretty simple really.

[WhipE350]

Let me change the channel and see what fear GB is stirring up. At 20% I think I'm going to hire a couple of great mechanics and make my million in the first year. Not doubting there is a flaw and I will check my filter regularly...but let's see if I can service 10% of 40,000 or 15 cars a day at $250.00 a car I would get my million. Really all kidding aside, hope I'm not in the %2. Cheers!!

[Paul]

The reality is that if it happens to a 986 it is basically totaled from a financial view point.

I've told customers to avoid cars in the 80,000 to 120,000 mile range for years, once again I should have followed my own advice and traded my 01 in for a new car. I just don't want to part with a car that Peter Porsche autographed.

Jake puts up with a lot of comments from owners like me and others, but in the end, he is one of the few guys that actually cares enough about this problem to develop a fix.

For me, my very successful years owning and beating Porsches without an engine failure made me delay doing what I knew I should do. That and being way too busy....

[Perfectlap]

^ can you really call it a fix though? That might be misleading. I think it may be better viewed as reducing an already low probability to an even lower likelyhood but you are still in the woods.

at any rate even if is 2% that's some pretty ****************ty engineering. or I should say ****************ty engineering for consecutive years. I guess some don't like to admit error.

[dmatz]

I have an 04 Boxster that had confirmed IMS failure last week at 58K miles. Dealer employees, including service managers, have admitted to me that they have a significant number of IMS failures in this engine, and didn’t deny that it should have been a recall. I didn’t know of this defect until it (probably) happened to me, and feel angry that Porsche sold me a car without revealing a fatal design flaw (sealed bearing with seal that fails in normal use, then relying on inadequate lubrication from crankcase oil splash).
When I called Porsche (1-800 Porsche), I was told there was no recall for the IMS defect because “the government orders recalls and they didn’t order a recall” for the IMS issue. Recalls are triggered by complaints to the NHTSA – not very many complaints, no recall. NHTSA complaints and investigations can be researched at their website: http://www.safercar.gov/Vehicle+Owners . Between MY 2000 and 2005 there were only 6 IMS failures reported withe std or S Boxsters. Brief internet searches reveal that the actual failure rate is certainly much higher than these numbers would suggest. Complaints can easily be filed at the NHTSA website. If everyone with IMS failures went to the NHTSA website and filed a complaint, perhaps an investigation and thus a recall might be triggered. I’m not sure if a recall could be ordered for cars this old, but at least the relevant government agency should adequately notified. If the government took action, Porsche would be forced to respond.

[WhipE350]

Originally Posted by dmatz

Between MY 2000 and 2005 there were only 6 IMS failures reported withe std or S Boxsters.

Probably because they weren't starting to fail yet, or folks just don't know to report it. Do those 6 cover the all reports up to today? Sorry it happened to you, is your car motor shot?

[dmatz]

My count from the NHTSA database was as of last week. I think people simply don't know about the complaint mechanism. I didn't untill I hit the internet. Yes, my motor is shot. I'm choosing to actually spend the money to resurrect my car by putting a crate engine in - about $18K. My advice: never name your car.

[Jager]

Originally Posted by dmatz

My count from the NHTSA database was as of last week. I think people simply don't know about the complaint mechanism. I didn't untill I hit the internet. Yes, my motor is shot. I'm choosing to actually spend the money to resurrect my car by putting a crate engine in - about $18K. My advice: never name your car.

How often did you change your oil? What brand of oil and wieght? How far did you drive on average after startup?

Thanks
Jager

[dmatz]

Originally Posted by Jager

How often did you change your oil? What brand of oil and wieght? How far did you drive on average after startup?

Thanks
Jager

I now know (after the fact of the failure, and after learning of the defect only from the internet), that I was the poster child for IMS failure risk. I only changed oil at the Porsche-recommended intervals (15k miles; 0W40 Mobil1; dealer servicing), drove the car mildly (40 mi 2-way commute druing the week at moderate freeway speeds), and let the car sit for extended periods during winter, using another car. I think there may have been warning signs (something I now think may have been bearing grinding noise), but I didn't know I needed to be vigilant for these signs, so I didn't pay attention. Believe me, if I had known, I would have behaved differently. The mechanic at the dealer was probably checking for metal in the filter, but no one told me I should be listening for bearing noises.

[landrovered]

The one positive of the IMS issue is I feel that I am doing a dis-service to my car if I do not drive it the way it was designed to be driven and it is a lot more fun to rev without guilt and to hoon without fear for lack of mechanical sympathy.

[thstone]

The Facebook page isn't really raging yet - 35 members and a few of those are people selling repair services.