Lower?? - Page 3 - 986 Forum - The Community for Porsche Boxster & Cayman Owners

Matt Fredrikson · 01-30-2010, 10:18 AM

I've read through a few threads on lowering now and I find that a lot of guys talk about what springs they used and the amount of drop ect. However I am not finding a lot of info on what shocks/ struts to use? I know in past cars I have lowered that lowering on the stock components would cause they to blow there seals for sure. There us a combo on pelican that looks pretty good but I'm wondering what you guys run or am I better to go full coilover? I have done this in the past but I don't plan to race my box as much as I did my Eclipse. Thanks for any input guys.

Johnny Danger · 01-30-2010, 11:59 AM

Certain that it is, a lot of enthusiasts have gone the route of lower springs, and from what I understand, many of them have been satisfied with the end result. However, some purists contend that compatible issues can arise between after market lowering springs, which can have an altogether different "rate" or stiffness from that of the oem ones, and the factory shocks. Namely, a lack of synergy exists between the suspension components simply because the "valving" of oem shock is not designed to handle this increase. Long term symptoms have included suspension "sag", shock failure and poor handling. Few would argue, that a well designed aftermarket coilover system can rule out these concerns. Essentially, manufacturers are able carefully select their valving and spring rates, along with adjustable dampening, to optimize cohesion amongst suspension parts to meet an array of driving conditions.

Matt Fredrikson · 02-01-2010, 09:53 AM

While that makes sense it dosn't really answer my question as I'm not looking for a full coilover setup. I've gone that route before and for this car I'd like to stick to a nice spring and shock combo but I am reading more and more that a lot of guys seem to stay with the stock shocks on the boxster.

My other question is how much camber increase do you normally see when lowering a boxster? My last car had huge negative camber issues that actually couldn't be compleatly fixed even with a camber kit. Does the stock adjustment offer enough adjustment for something like an h&r sport series?

Thanks again

Quickurt · 02-01-2010, 10:44 AM

To answer some of your concerns.
I asked the dealer exactly the same questions you are asking and most of it depends on how low you want to go.
For the 20mm I questioned on a 987 the factory accessory springs are well within the parameters of the stock shocks.
The 30mm lower springs are enough stiffer that new shocks are suggested, however, I was told several customers had gone that route without changing shocks and were not complaining.
Anything lower and coilovers are suggested.
I was told on both 20 mm and 30 mm lowering, the stock 987 suspension allowed enough adjustment to maintain proper alignment, albeit barely on the 30mm. Anything lower also required replacement/modified parts for alignment.
I do not know and did not ask about 986.
With the ways I use my car I am leaning heavily toward doing the 20 mm lowering.
Maybe wifey won't notice............

Gary H · 02-01-2010, 10:52 AM

Does anyone know if (visually) the 10mm drop with the MO30 kit on the 986 is noticeable?

Quickurt · 02-01-2010, 10:57 AM

A couple of other guys said that kit lowers the front almost 20mm and the rear 10mm.
10mm is 3/8", so it's not real noticable, but 3/4 in the front would make a difference. Changing the rake of the car will also effect understeer and it is probably the main reason for doing it that way.

Johnny Danger · 02-01-2010, 02:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Matt Fredrikson

While that makes sense it dosn't really answer my question as I'm not looking for a full coilover setup. I've gone that route before and for this car I'd like to stick to a nice spring and shock combo but I am reading more and more that a lot of guys seem to stay with the stock shocks on the boxster.

My other question is how much camber increase do you normally see when lowering a boxster? My last car had huge negative camber issues that actually couldn't be compleatly fixed even with a camber kit. Does the stock adjustment offer enough adjustment for something like an h&r sport series?

Thanks again

My vehicle has been lowered approximately 2 inches all around. In the final analysis, despite the dramatic change in ride height, realignment and chamber adjustment was successfully achieved without the need for chamber plates.. There is no reason why the same could not be accomplished with lowering springs. As far as the amount of chamber adjustment that is required, every vehicle is its own episode. Most after market lowering springs lower the vehicle anywhere from 1 inch to 1 1/2 inches. Anything less than that would seem negligible.

DamageINC123 · 02-01-2010, 05:03 PM

Take a look at the TechArt suspensions and I think you will be more than satisfied with the stance as well as the ride. Mine was done at the dealership before purschase so I am not exactly sure how much lower it actually is. I have never measured it against a stock 986 but would love to know the difference if anyone can tell me. The highest point on the edge of my fender is approximatley 24.5 inches off the ground.

Sorry for the pic. The weather is nasty outside!! The black trim piece in front of the rear wheel is 3 inches off the ground if that helps.

Quickurt · 02-02-2010, 10:33 AM

Just remember however much you lower while keeping the stock shocks is subtracting the same amount from shock travel. I.E. if they had 4" total compression travel and you lower 2" you now have only 2" compression travel before bottoming the shock and causing possible damamge to it.

edit: damange is damaging and mangling at the same time!!

Matt Fredrikson · 02-02-2010, 04:28 PM

Does techart offer a shock spring combo? Or only the lowering springs?

DamageINC123 · 02-02-2010, 05:12 PM

I am not exactly sure what TechArt offers on the shock /spring combo. My car was originally owned by the owner of the Porsche dealership in Atlanta, GA. I think the guys last name was Peel. He did the suspension and rims back when he owned it. From what I can tell on mine its only the springs. As far as the ride goes I have also driven a stock height 2000 and when I got back in mine it felt more like I was more in touch with road. Not a harsh ride as much as predictable and more controlable.

Johnny Danger · 02-03-2010, 03:43 AM

Not to belabor the topic, however, if one is willing to go to great lengths to pair up after market lower springs along with compatible shocks, why not get coilovers ? The money factor is not that far off, and in my opinion the design benefits are superior. Also, I sincerely doubt that there is anything unique or different about Techart's lowering springs compared to other top quality brands other than their high price tag. In fact, I strongly suspect that they there sourced from someone like H&R, wherein they simply put their name on them.

ekam · 02-03-2010, 03:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Johnny Danger

Not to belabor the topic, however, if one is willing to go to great lengths to pair up after market lower springs along with compatible shocks, why not get coilovers ? The money factor is not that far off, and in my opinion the design benefits are superior. Also, I sincerely doubt that there is anything unique or different about Techart's lowering springs compared to other top quality brands other than their high price tag. In fact, I strongly suspect that they there sourced from someone like H&R, wherein they simply put their name on them.

Coilovers require corner balancing and more precise adjustments = more $ than just buying the set.

Johnny Danger · 02-03-2010, 05:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ekam

Coilovers require corner balancing and more precise adjustments = more $ than just buying the set.

Roughly the same amount of time and money would be spent installing springs, shocks and realigning the vehicle as compared to coilovers. Height adjustment and corner balancing is not a major undertaking or a large cost increase.

Quickurt · 02-03-2010, 05:57 AM

I have to agree with Johnny here. If you're going to go to the point of lowering your car by 2 or more inches, coilovers would be my only choice. I did them on a couple of IT cars, over the years, and it's not that big a deal. It's probably easier than dealing with the stock struts, as they are a pain in the ass and if you go that low, you will need to check and correct corner weights anyway - no two springs in a set are identical. Adjusting corner weights without coilovers? Nightmare.

ekam · 02-03-2010, 06:00 AM

You can get a complete M030 set from Suncoast for $1100, decent coilovers from KW, JIC or JRZ/Moton costs $2500 and up.

I don't see how twice the cost as "just a little more".

And I'm not planning to go that low. Not in this city filled with pot holes I won't.

Matt Fredrikson · 02-03-2010, 07:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ekam

You can get a complete M030 set from Suncoast for $1100, decent coilovers from KW, JIC or JRZ/Moton costs $2500 and up.

I don't see how twice the cost as "just a little more".

And I'm not planning to go that low. Not in this city filled with pot holes I won't.

agreed, perhaps goig M030 with h&r sport springs would be my best option

Johnny Danger · 02-03-2010, 08:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Matt Fredrikson

agreed, perhaps goig M030 with h&r sport springs would be my best option

You can purchase a PSS9 kit for around 2k, KW variant 2 kit or an H&R coilover kit for around $1,700.00+. I've seem PSS9 kits from reputable sources on Ebay go for well under 2k.

Matt Fredrikson · 02-03-2010, 08:28 AM

I would go coilover for 2G for sure but M030 for 1100 also has sway bars. I'm starting to lean that way the only thing I havn't found is if the shocks in the M030 kit are an actuall upgrade over stock S shocks. If not, just springs and sways seems to be a very economical alternative to coilovers.

DamageINC123 · 02-03-2010, 11:29 AM

I think we have answered the question on "Lower??" Sounds like most people prefer lower. Springs or coils would be up to you.
Mine happend to have springs already on the car when I bought it. Yes my springs say TechArt and yes Johnny you are probably right when it comes to stamping their name on someone elses spring. However, TechArt doesnt just stamp their name on just anyones spring. The rims are TechArt but they came from OZ Racing. Whoever made them for TechArt did them right. No complaints on the ride from me or anyone else who has been behind the wheel.
Bottom line is if you lower do it right. Dont cheap out or you will have the issues mentioned in this thread.