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Old 01-05-2008, 04:24 PM   #1
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If only MNBoxster had not traded his Porsche for a Vespa scooter, he would be here holding forth at great length...still can't believe anyone would substitute a Vespa for a Box...
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Old 01-05-2008, 05:31 PM   #2
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There's a few really good points made here. Forgive me if I go on a little, but I assure you that none of the following was copied from some other web site .

To start with, as everyone has said, horsepower, or more directly, torque increases with air density. To put is simply, the more mass of air you can get into a cylinder the more force the combustion process will have on that cylinder when it's lit. Typical fluids, air included, get less dense with higher temperature, meaning there is less mass of a given volume as the temperature of the fluid increases. The fuel metering system in the car can sense the increase or decrease in air temperature and volume and adjust fuel flow accordingly, allowing for the proper mixture for good combustion.

Topless, it's true that a turbine engine, such as a jet on an airplane can also make more power under cooler air conditions, but power isn't the reason for the longer runway needed for take-off. That's due to the differences in ar density providing differences in lift. Hotter air, being less dense, provides less lift so the plane needs to be going faster before the lift force is sufficient to raise the plane.

Gary in BR, an intercooler uses outside air to cool the intake charge of a turbocharged engine. The charge has been heated by the act of compressing the air. It is then passed a radiator that exchanges heat with air from the outside of the car to bring the charge temp closer to atmospheric. In a normally aspirated engine, there is no compression of the intake charge so air temp doesn't raise anywhere close to that of a turbocharged car Running the intake air through a radiator that can't lower temps below atmospheric anyway would serve little purpose. Intercooling is a huge airflow restriction that can only be justified if the effects of the pressure drop are offset by the effects of providing a cooler intake charge.
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Old 01-05-2008, 08:09 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blue2000s

Topless, it's true that a turbine engine, such as a jet on an airplane can also make more power under cooler air conditions, but power isn't the reason for the longer runway needed for take-off. That's due to the differences in ar density providing differences in lift. Hotter air, being less dense, provides less lift so the plane needs to be going faster before the lift force is sufficient to raise the plane.
Yeah I know... which is exactly what I said.
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Old 01-05-2008, 09:08 PM   #4
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I never actually thought about it, but now that you mention it. I have been feeling more power since it has gotten colder. Thanks for pointing that out.

It would be interesting to see a dyno test at 70° and at 35° to see if there is a significant power difference.
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Old 01-05-2008, 09:34 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Topless
Yeah I know... which is exactly what I said.
The way I read it, it sounded like you were referring to variations in engine power having something to do with the length needed for take off.
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Old 01-06-2008, 03:16 AM   #6
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Here's the verdict. 1% increase in Horsepower every 10 degree colder. :dance: You do the math. It makes quite a difference. Comparing 90-100 degree summer vs. the 10-20 degree winter.

http://blogs.sportcompactcarweb.com/1004173/editorials/cold-weather-horsepower/index.html

http://image.sportcompactcarweb.com/f/editorials/cold-weather-horsepower/1032071+w700+cr1+re0+ar1/dyno-pull.jpg
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Old 01-07-2008, 07:04 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ichiro75
Here's the verdict. 1% increase in Horsepower every 10 degree colder. :dance:
It's not quite that much, but it's a decent rule of thumb.
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Old 01-07-2008, 10:24 AM   #8
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Assuming you are talking about Fahrenheit degrees, and only density effects, it's actually bigger than 1%/10F. The math is quite trivial, just turn your temperatures into absolute (Rankine scale) and divide them (the ideal gas law, more specifically Guy-Lussac's law, only have linear terms making things easy).

E.g.,

t0 = 70F = 529R
t1 = 60F = 519R
density change = t0/t1 = 529/519 = 1.019

In other words, 1.9% increase in density.

(Hey, admins, fix the [ code ] block in your php...)
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