Blown Engine
 

:( This is my first post on this forum. I wanted to tell what happened to my wife’s Boxster:

Last year I bought her a new 2006 Boxster with Tiptronic. The car now is about a year and a half old and has just over 12,000 miles on it. We live in a cold climate (Minnesota), so the car is stored in a garage from December to March. The car is never driven very hard. It has never been on the track. It hasn’t been modified in any way.

Two weeks ago my wife was driving my son to a birthday party on a Saturday. She was on the freeway when she accelerated to pass a car. Suddenly something didn’t feel right with the car. A few seconds later the “check engine” light started flashing and the car started beeping at her. A message on the instrument panel told her to get the car to a Porsche dealer immediately. She pulled off the freeway and turned the car off. After that it would not start.

She called Porsche Roadside Assistance who sent a tow truck. The car was towed to the nearest dealership (Carousel Porsche, Minnesota) where they didn’t even look at it for 3 days. They pulled the engine and started taking it apart. The service manager checked a computer readout and was able to tell that the car had not been driven in an abusive manner. He said he was able to tell it had never been over-revved. They eventually determined that there was a hole in one valve lifter which caused it to fail. This apparently led to significant engine damage.

Next the service manager told us that Porsche wanted them to take the engine apart piece by piece and catalog all the damaged parts to determine if our engine should be fixed or replaced. He described this as a tedious process, and he didn’t seem very enthusiastic about doing it. He dragged it out over several days, and eventually announced to us that Porsche had authorized replacement of our engine with a rebuilt engine. Tomorrow it will be exactly 2 weeks since the car died, and it still isn’t fixed. We’re hoping it will be done by early next week. My wife is very unhappy because these are the last few days of the driving season here in Minnesota, and she has missed them. We’ll be putting the car away for the winter again soon. The service manager’s attitude is that we should be happy that Porsche is fixing our car under warranty. My wife is now nervous about driving the car. She is afraid of taking any long trips because she is afraid of getting stranded somewhere far from home or a dealership.

I have a number of questions regarding this experience. Has anyone out there had this happen to their Boxster? It seems like the dealership has taken their sweet time repairing the car. Is that pretty common? Is a rebuilt engine going to last as long and be as good as the original engine? Is this going to reduce the future resale value of our car? Any thoughts?

I'd be very happy with getting a free factory remanufactured engine from germany. It is the best you could have hoped for.

The biggest cause of engine failures people talk about is IMS (intermediate shaft) failure. Sounds like you did not experience that, but the net effects (blown engire) were just as bad. Anytime something bad like this happens be very grateful you are under warrantly and don't have to spend 12K on a re-mfg'd engine.

Also be happy they did not decide to rebuild your current junk engine

First off, total engine failures in the Box are NOT rare, they are reported here from time to time.

Second, Porsche has changed its policy. They used to simply swap in a new engine and do it pretty quickly. Now, they do what you are experiencing.

Puzzling to say the least. If I had a new Porsche with a blown engine, the last thing I would want to do is wait until these turds got around to fixing it.

Moreover, personally, I would never buy another Porsche, but that is me.

From a corporate perspective, I just don't get it.

But then again, the Germans are totally arrogant when it comes to these things.

PS- I am of German heritage.

Best of luck.

:)

Well, think of it this way. This is the same factory that built the first engine that failed. So, you could look at this as a glass half empty also.

:D

I don't understand your logic here. The guys 60K dollar car has a engine melt down when less than 2 yrs old.

Why should he be GRATEFUL for a new engine?

I am sorry this happened to you. Sometimes you just get a bad motor...yes in a Porsche or even a Toyota. Thank goodness for warranties. It is very annoying but not uncommon for a dealer to take 2-3 weeks to sort everything out when this happens.

My advice to you is to try to be patient and let them fix it good as new. A Porsche Reman. motor should be like new in every way and should not affect resale value.

Randijo, sorry about the issues you are having. Don't fret about future problems, take that road trip, that's what cell phones are for and roadside assistance, if needed.

Don't forget to properly break-in the new motor. Re-read your owners manual. Negotiate with the dealership and possibly PCNA and see if they will upgarde the engine to the 3.2L. Worth a couple grand out-of-pocket if you asked me.

I would still rather have a Porsche, with a potentail for break down, than no Porsche at all. :)

Richard, comments like this are reckless and unnecessary. Not to mention a stereotype. You are a smarter man than this. :(

So what if you of German heritage. That gives the the right to bash an entire country?

Remind us again then, Richard, why are you even here? This is a place for Porsche enthustiests not cantacerous & angry old men.

I wouldn't stress about it. A replaced engine means you have another chance at getting an engine that will not break down. I have done two 1600 roundtrip road trips in my Boxster with no problems.
Getting a bad engine in a Boxster is just the luck of the draw. Get you car, break in the engine, and enjoy. Once you pass 25K miles your chances of an engine failure decrease dramatically. But extended warranties are always a good backup.
:cheers:

As I understand it, porsches new policy is either attempt to fix the engine at the dealer (yuck!) or get a re-mfg'd engine from germany. I'd be much more comfortable with the latter. Obviously, it stinks it broke in the first place but at least you aren't having it fixed at the shop. If you complain in the right way, maybe you can get them to extend your warranty some more or give you a special longer warranty on the replaced engine?

I am not bashing an entire country. Let me be clearer. The German car makers exhibit an arrogance (IMHO) that I find puzzling and annoying. I have owned many BMWs, Porsches,, VW, and Mercedes and candidly, my experiences has been consistent. If something breaks, YOU are suspect, it is never THEIR car.

There is nothing reckless in my statements. The man just had a new engine blow and the companies response is to take their sweet time fixing it.

As a customer, I would find this inexcusable. They should be bending over backwards to satisfy this customer (IMHO). This is not a $15K cCvic, it is a Porsche.

As a country, Germany is well know for their engineering. I don't think anyone would accuse them of being warm and fuzzy, nor are they know for their customer satisfaction.

Data abounds on this fact by the way.

Cultures are the way they are. The reputation is not borne out of thin air.


:D

A dealer cannot replace an engine without getting the ok from Atlanta or the dealer will not get paid. As of 2005 dealers are authorized to do engine repairs.

What I think is going on. Taking an engine apart in an attempt to fix it takes a lot of time, but Porsche will pay the dealer only so much for warranty work. I have never asked the hourly rate for warranty work but I suspect it is less then the usual rate charged customers.

The Cayenne is having problems with plastic coolant tubes on top of the engine that split. The engine has to be removed to replace these tubes. This is warranty work so the dealer is paid by Atlanta to replace the tubes. One of the people I spoke to did not like it because it takes a lot of time to drop the engine and Atlanta pays only so much. So a dealer has to do this work and get X dollars when they could be using that time to make more than X dollars.

One of these days I will try to find out more details on how warranty payments work.

Wow thats pretty harsh. Time to start a different forum? What made your experiences so bad? I've owned 3 porsche and had little problems, but I know some people have major problems, but what car brands dont have problems here or there? My 2008 Hummer h2 overheated with 1000 miles , seems they forgot to tighten a coolant hose, had 6 family members in the car. Ferraris and Lambos have even MORE problems even with only a few thousand miles on the ticker theyre maintenance queens. It happens to the best of em. Have to look at the positives and not the negatives, if you looked at the negatives of any car you wouldnt be driving let alone enjoying it!

At least this staetment explains your attitude. Doesn't excuse it but explains it.

I live in MN and have had good experiences with Maplewood Imports. I have not used Carousel for service. It sucks that your engine failed but getting a remanufactured engine, which is really just like a new engine, is the best possible outcome. I've read on this forum and others that the reman engines have all newly updated components and go thru more rigorous testing than regular production engines. One suggestion, see if Carousel will give you a Cayman to use as a loaner. They have quite a few in stock and I heard that they may be using one or two as loaners. If they are providing a loaner, even if it's a crappy Pontiac, they will be incented to move faster. Good luck.

I totally respect Bruceleee, but I have to say that I disagree. While people may post RMS failures commonly, on this forum. You have to remember that forums are an outlet for people with bad experiences to share there problem with there P-Car, or just talk. There are plenty of Boxster owners that never have been to a forum, and have never had a problem. The Boxster owners who are part of this forum, are a small percentage of the Boxster owners in the world, so you have to take the reports of RMS, out of the hundreds of thousands of Boxsters not just the few hundred active 986forum members.
:cheers:

Good points and I admit my experience may be atypical. We never really have any data on the IMS and RMS failures so we simply go with what we have.

I am not happy with the way Porsche seems to suspect folks who show up with blown motors. My neighbor got the third degree when here new 986 engine blew with 11 k miles on it. She was sort of terrified by the third degree she got.

Seems to me, they could have been apologizing instead. They know that these motors are prone to IMS failures, so why the attitude?

Food for thought.


:D

I agree and disagree with a lot that is said here..

Porsche service seems to have a LOT to do with the dealership itself. The experience differs from one to the next. The dealer CAN fight for the customer and even make the discussion transparent to the customer IF they choose to. This has a lot to do with why enthusiasts choose one dealer over another.

As for the engine failure issue, reality is, most people don't seek out forums like this one until they have a reason to vent, thus the first appearance in places like this is to announce something catastrophic. To that end, it makes things seem much worse than they really are. I have a number of friends with porsches new and old and none have ever had so much as an engine light come on (same applies to me 3 porsches later). It does puzzle me how many people have 98-2001 cars that do have issues and complain to the heavens about engine failures or other problems as if it should be under warranty. The cars are approaching 10 years old at this point in some cases, nearly double the normal factory warranty time frame. Why do people expect porsche to put a brand new engine in a 10 year old car for free? Even if it's got 10 miles on it, it's still 10 years old. Mileage is one thing, time is another. You hear all the RMS/IMS noise constantly from those that feel the need to be vocal after it happens to them, but i'd be willing to bet it effects less than 1 percent of the cars out there.

Anyway, i'm ranting, I know :) Just try to put the whole RMS/IMS issue in true perspective and BUY THAT WARRANTY on a used car!

In dealers defense, they see a lot of blown engines that are caused by abuse. When replacing engines under warranty, I'm sure dealers get a fair bit of scrutiny from PCNA. They need to make sure they get reimbursed so they ask questions and check OBD. Some dealers may cross the line into disrespectful interrogation. If that happens, talk to Service Manager, rip them on the surveys, or go to a different dealer. But you can't expect them not to ask any questions when they are footing the bill.

I agree, like the original poster here for instance. His first thread was about his engine failure. If the engine didn't implode he would be happily motoring along like the majority of boxster owners out there and we wouldn't even know he existed.

You seem very down on Porsche, especially for a BB enthusiast. I agree with you that a tedious process for a new car owner is a frustration. I do not think that the Boxster total failure is common, especially when contrasted against the production numbers. I have seen many Boxsters for sale over the 100K mark in mileage.

As far as not buying another Porsche, I'd dare say my car has improved my mental health. I love the Boxster, it makes every trip special. Sure Porsches are expensive to maintain, I paid around 1,800.00 for a 944 clutch job. I also had a colleague who paid 15,000.00 for a 328GTB clutch job. For most of us in here, we like grease, wrenches and the satisfaction of placing our own hands on our creations, the joy of subtle tweaks we engineer into our cars; it's a religious experience. I'll say this, if my 2.5 blows up (1998, 24,600) I won't put a 2.5 back in but there will be no for sale sign either...

Hope everyone is enjoying the holiday, peace Yo's

I love the cars, I am not high on the company. I don't think they value customers very much unless you march to their tune.

Just an opinion and there is nothing like a box.

Your observation is spot on, after all Ferrari wouldn't sell you a car if he didn't like you. I agree it's a piece of the sports car heritage we could do without.

Dealers should provide a loaner car for warranty work that takes more than a day.

Dealers should complete work quickly.

Notice I did not say anything about Porsche, all dealers should do this.

That said, enjoy your car, most of the failures reported on this board have had absolutely nothing to do with the way the car was driven. Warm it up, stomp it!!!

BTW I just put another 2500 miles on my Boxster in less than a week (WI to Rennsport III and back) including many 7000 RPM shifts especially while on the Tail of the Dragon.

I know exactly what BruceLee is talking about. I had my Boxster engine fail at 22,500 miles couple of months ago. I took it into the local Porsche dealer here and they immediately started accusing me of running the engine too hard when I told them "I think my engine blew". I was at 35 mph in 2nd when it went. I went at it with the service manager about accusing me of with no ounce of proof. It took 3 days to get back to me with "yeah your going to need a new engine". No explanation of the cause and basically dancing around every question on why the engine blew. Needless to say, took it to a 2nd place and, come to find out it was the cable tensioner that caused the premature engine failure. I loved driving the Porsche when it was running, but after the treatment I got from Porsche local dealer and Porsche NA, I seriously doubt I would buy another Porsche. Leaves a very bitter taste in my mouth.

Those who say engine failures are far and few, take a look at Nov 2007 issue of Road and Track. They did a 10 yr look back at the boxster.

Here is an excerpt:
"Then, beginning in late 1998, with model year 1999 cars, there was the dreaded cylinder liner failure. If a Boxster owner was lucky, the engine would merely blow a head gasket and dump it's coolant. For other owners, the engine would self-destruct in a catastrophic failure. It's rumored that as many as 50 percent of the 1999 Boxsters had liner failure."

"Boxster engine swaps became common enough that Porsche mechanics began referring to the CEL on the instrument panel not as the "Check Engine Light" but as the "Change Engine Light".

If this happen to me I would sell it fast as I can after the repairs are done because.
1. Once you get the car back it will be stored for the winter and you'll never really know if it runs better/worse until you take it out of storage.
2. Your wife feelings- Having that awful feeling if you are going to break down doesn't make it any fun driving the boxster.
Sell... sell... sell.....just my 2 cents.
Good luck on whatever you decide on

Contrast story.

I have a Lexus I bought used recently. I had some concerns and took it in for a diagnostic. The car is way out of warranty but I know the guys at the dealership and they serviced this car since it was new.

They spent a couple of hours on the car, told me it was finde gave me a Lexus loaner for the day. Got a nice free latte in their lounge, valet guys washed my car when they gave it back to me.

They charged me zero and thanked me for my business.

That is customer service and I am a customer for life because of it.

The Boxster is a car deserving of a better dealer network and manufacturer.

IMHO. :)

This is an excellent contrast to my continued bad experiences with Paul Miller Porsche here in NJ.

If I am not mistaken, the unusually good Lexus experience is one of the pillars of their business model. I love my Boxster and have been a Porsche fan for most of my life, but this sort of thing would prompt me to consider a Lexus when it is finally time to give up my Box.

yuppthey act as if they are doing me a favor when i go there...needless to say, they don't get my buisness at Miller either

I have owned or currently own Porsche, BMW, Infiniti, Honda, Toyota, and Ford. Of those manufacturers, the only one who had exceptional customer service was Infiniti. I always got a free loaner car, which was a new Infiniti, every time I took the car in for service. I was always treated like I owned the most expensive model of Infiniti, when in fact, I owned the cheapest. The car's quality was fantastic - none of the continuous, niggling problems I've come to expect as normal from BMW and Porsche, and certainly, none of the major issues such as engine failures, tranny failures, and chassis problems.

Toyota's service is good, but it's more of an impersonal mill, with so many cars in for service, not unlike Ford. I've had reasonably good experiences at BMW and Porsche service, but they're closer to Ford and Toyota than to Infiniti. My BMW's quality of service went up dramatically, once my car was out of warranty and I started going to a local BMW shop that knows how to treat their customers.

Fact is, that despite these problems, we put up with it because at the end of the day, an Infiniti or a Toyota doesn't begin to offer the driving experience of a BMW or a Porsche. I've driven most of the "sporty" Infiniti's and Lexus's and IMO it's not what I want in a driver's car.

Same here, my 96 LS400 was stalling everytime we stop at a red light. Took it to Germain Lexus and they replace the ECU and give me a loaner. No charged even after the warranty has past for about two years. Go figure!

My DD is a Hyundai Elantra and whenever I take it to the dealer to get warranty work or maintenance done the always give me a loaner car as long as I call a few days in advance. They also treat me very well, even though the car is 6 years old and pretty much the cheapest type car in the lot.

If Hyundai can give customer service like that then a Porsche dealership had better as well.

Who do you use then? I have just gone to Powertech for everything so far, they are fantastic, but if it is a warrantee item, then I need to go to a dealer. Have you found a good one? I have heard rumors that the dealership in Newark is good. Of course, that would require going to Newark…

having been into porsches for a long time and seen Powertech's work over the years...I would NEVER go there...
I bring my car to Newton Motorsports, the service manager is nice and they don't kill me. When it is out of warranty I will likely use Haupt Strasse motors in Harriman NY (it is not too far from me or you really) He is a trained Porsche master tech, has a pst2 and is fair to deal with...you should call him, you would save a bunch from Powertech I suspect. (845)783-1425. (I had a bad experience with Powertech years ago...with my 914..and then again with my 77 911s..they swapped motors in my car...and then told me my motor was bad(it was fine and I had the serial number, when I got it back after they said it was bad...it was not the same motor. :mad:
That and they totally misrepresent cars they sell routinely...like the yellow 914 2.0 they just sold saying it was a low mile un molested car...never painted or modded..I saw that car run at lime rock..I knew the prior owner ...it had lots of work...including a new passenger quarter..but they said it was ALL original..yea to creative coach works spray booth....

The dealer where I live might as well have horns and a pitchfork. After my friend who has bought three brand new cars from them asked if they would help me with my radio code they just blew me off. If they see you in an older Porsche they don't even bother to greet you, all they want is to sell new cars. The parts counter is good and has good guys working it but for service they suck. When I had my 944 they did the belts and I got it back leaking like the Exxon Valdeez, they said it was my fault for not asking for the seal to be replaced during the job. I paid to have the car taken apart again and seal replaced and never went back. On another dealer visit, a mechanic was kind enough to show me a problem after I paid my service tab in cash. The owners wife pulled me aside and told me they pay their mechanic well and I'm not to use his time to gain knowledge about any home done repairs, talk about WTF ,they went out of business the next year, hahaha. I always use an independent shop and do what else I can myself. To this day I only have one key because I already know the dealer will bone me stupid if I ask him to program a second one, Porsche has too loose a grip on their dealer network and it shows, perhaps they should come out with a "limited edition" dealer.

wow, thanks for the information. That is the first bad thing I have heard about Powertech - a bit unsettling. I will check out Newton. It's only about 30 miles from me. Thanks!

I want to thank everyone for their advice and comments. I can now tell the rest of the story. This past Monday the service manager at Carousel Porsche called to let us know our Boxster was finally ready, with a new factory remanufactured engine. We went over the dealership to pick the car up, but when we arrived we found that there were several scratches on the otherwise flawless finsh of our beautiful Boxster. The service manager subsequently admitted that his mechanics had scratched up our car while pulling the engine. (Keep in mind this was the mechanic who Porsche was going to have rebuild our old engine before they finally agreed to give us a new one). After another two days at the body shop the paint finally was back to its original beauty. Today, after 18 days, we finally got to drive our Porsche home. I wouldn't recommend this dealership to anyone.

A sad ending to a sad story.

:mad:

At least they were honest about the scratches and you didn't have to battle them over that as well.