Finally: Dyno charts of de-snorked 986S!!! - 986 Forum - The Community for Porsche Boxster & Cayman Owners

porsche986spyder · 02-22-2007, 07:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bavarian Motorist

I will not even bother putting a wire mesh because I don't smoke and no one who drives my car will smoke.

The mesh will also help keep "leaves" out and other stuff that flies up from the road like other peoples cigaret buds.

02-22-2007, 07:11 AM

He accually removed a restrictor plate thats in front of the intake.

porsche986spyder · 02-22-2007, 07:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by boggtown

He accually removed a restrictor plate thats in front of the intake.

Oh yes, that too. But left the snorkle on the 987.

Bavarian Motorist · 02-22-2007, 07:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by porsche986spyder

Oh yes, that too. But left the snorkle on the 987.

Now I am confused. So there is a snorkel somewhere also? Do you know where it is?

porsche986spyder · 02-22-2007, 07:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bavarian Motorist

Now I am confused. So there is a snorkel somewhere also? Do you know where it is?

You can see it in that list you posted. The guy did not remove it for some reason. He only removed the restrictor plate and retaining ring. Not sure why he stopped there. Look at the part sitting next to the dyno in the picture below in the original post. That's the SNORKLE part. It's just shown sitting straight up instead of the way you would normally see it inside the vent area. Hope this helps.

Bavarian Motorist · 02-22-2007, 07:50 AM

Thanks. My final noob question on this matter (hopefully) is can it be removed from the vent or only from the engine?

porsche986spyder · 02-22-2007, 08:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bavarian Motorist

Thanks. My final noob question on this matter (hopefully) is can it be removed from the vent or only from the engine?

From what I've heard it can be done from the outside on both 987 & 986 models. Still wish someone would direct me to the how-to post on removing the SNORKLE part. I know someone recenlty just yanked on it and it came right out after some effort. But I want to make sure I don't break anything, so I'm not recomending that way.

porsche986spyder · 02-22-2007, 07:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by boggtown

He accually removed a restrictor plate thats in front of the intake.

How come the 986 doesn't have this restrictor plate in front of it to begin with and the 987 does?

Bavarian Motorist · 02-22-2007, 07:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by porsche986spyder

The mesh will also help keep "leaves" out and other stuff that flies up from the road like other peoples cigaret buds.

Not worth the 2 dollars to me!!!

Just kidding.

RandallNeighbour · 02-22-2007, 07:35 AM

Now where are all the critical comments from forum members who have said emphatically that desnorkeling will not increase HP at all and it's all about making the intake a little louder?

Lurking now, aren't you?

porsche986spyder · 02-22-2007, 07:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RandallNeighbour

Now where are all the critical comments from forum members who have said emphatically that desnorkeling will not increase HP at all and it's all about making the intake a little louder?

Lurking now, aren't you?

When people always referred to "de-snorkle" I thought they were talking about the intake tube that contains the little extra noise/silencer box that sticks out from the tube just before the throtle body. I had no idea there was another "snorkle" shaped device in front of the air box, that one could remove fronm the outside. I think many others were thinking of the C.A.I. tubbing also. I'm deffinately going to remove this "snorkle" part now.

Bavarian Motorist · 02-22-2007, 07:44 AM

If you are referring to that guide I posted, the author said that Porsche added it for the 987 because of the cigarette incident...

porsche986spyder · 02-22-2007, 07:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bavarian Motorist

If you are referring to that guide I posted, the author said that Porsche added it for the 987 because of the cigarette incident...

That's funny, because I heard that was the reason for the CUP shaped part.

porsche986spyder · 02-22-2007, 07:57 AM

I wonder if the shape of the snorkle tube being a long smooth part leading up to the intake had some type of airflow/aerodynamics pupose. Therefore it would have been better to test it on the dyno with a fan blowing on the intake vent to simulate the car moving forward, since it was sitting still when you did the before and after test. Just a thought to consider for future testing.

MNBoxster · 02-22-2007, 01:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RandallNeighbour

Now where are all the critical comments from forum members who have said emphatically that desnorkeling will not increase HP at all and it's all about making the intake a little louder?

Lurking now, aren't you?

Hi,

Just caught this thread - see: http://www.pca.org/tech/tech_qa_question.asp?id={5628EC8F-3626-40D2-8AE0-E9F524E0718F} . I'm still not totally convinced, I think there's an error in the methodology. That's an approx. 6 CHP gain, and I'm just not convinced this part robs 6 HP. I can hold a thermometer in my hand and watch the Mercury rise, that doesn't mean I've made the room any warmer, or conversely, that I have cooled the room when I release the thermometer. There's no reason for Porsche to do it...

Happy Motoring!... Jim'99

Bavarian Motorist · 02-22-2007, 02:11 PM

I'm not sure if the thermometer analogy conceptually applies here.

pecivil · 02-22-2007, 02:22 PM

Bisimoto!!

Welcome to the board! You are definitely the kind of Boxster guy we need on here.

I would love to drop by your place and test my engine. There are some great roads through the hills in Hacienda hts. I have transplanted a 3.4l 996 carrera engine in my car. I have revo software, the K&N intake and a somewhat screwed up set of headers, 200 cell cats and muffler from a shop in Maryland that was supposed to be designed for the swap. Alas, the exhaust system sounds really great, but there are fitment issues with suspension. I would love to see what you come up with for the 3.2 engine exhaust wise. The 3.4 and 3.2 are (almost) the same engine.

If you need/want a guinea pig for exhaust system work, I would be happy to volunteer!!

BTW nice work on the desnorkleing. I did this a long time ago, and decided it was worth it just for the sound. Glad to see it does add a bit of torque.

Monte

Bisimoto · 02-22-2007, 09:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pecivil

Bisimoto!!

Welcome to the board! You are definitely the kind of Boxster guy we need on here.

I would love to drop by your place and test my engine. There are some great roads through the hills in Hacienda hts. I have transplanted a 3.4l 996 carrera engine in my car. I have revo software, the K&N intake and a somewhat screwed up set of headers, 200 cell cats and muffler from a shop in Maryland that was supposed to be designed for the swap. Alas, the exhaust system sounds really great, but there are fitment issues with suspension. I would love to see what you come up with for the 3.2 engine exhaust wise. The 3.4 and 3.2 are (almost) the same engine.

If you need/want a guinea pig for exhaust system work, I would be happy to volunteer!!

BTW nice work on the desnorkleing. I did this a long time ago, and decided it was worth it just for the sound. Glad to see it does add a bit of torque.

Monte

Greetings Monte,
Feel free to call my facility, and we can set up a good time to baseline your powerplant. I love the porsche 6-cyl, and look forward to applying some concepts to extract power. I may even take you up on the exhaust testing. I also appreciate your kind words.

Jim, I fail to understand why you feel this test is not factual. I duplicated both results, twice, as stated on page 1. As an engineer, who takes pride in being meticulous, I understand the value of repeating experiments to ensure validity. Such attention to detail has allowed me success in my present field of racing. In addition, I even invested in the most accurate and repeatable chassis dynamometer...no skimping there either.

I am here to share my experience, not to blow hot smoke. Feel free to perform the same tests...I am confident that you will perceive similar results.

In regard to the NACA ducts..at least we agree on that:

I use it to supply cool air to my induction throats!

porsche986spyder · 02-22-2007, 02:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bavarian Motorist

I'm not sure if the thermometer analogy conceptually applies here.

I agree. I look at the dyno results. I think it speaks for itself. By the way the link the other guy posted by PCA says he thinks by doing this we are removing the cooler air from the outside!?! Makes no sence, all we are doing is removing something that is restricting the air flow, not REMOVING the air flow all together, nor are we re-directing it from some place else, like from the inside of the engine. It will still pull the air from the outside! Look how close the opening is to the vents.

MNBoxster · 02-22-2007, 02:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by porsche986spyder

I agree. I look at the dyno results. I think it speaks for itself. By the way the link the other guy posted by PCA says he thinks by doing this we are removing the cooler air from the outside!?! Makes no sence, all we are doing is removing something that is restricting the air flow, not REMOVING the air flow all together, nor are we re-directing it from some place else, like from the inside of the engine. It will still pull the air from the outside! Look how close the opening is the the vents.

Hi,

Dyno results can be funny and not always verifiable or repeatable. The Lister must admit this if he's the kind of engineer, he seems to be.

So many variables must be exactly the same on each run for any results to be meaningful, especially since you're claiming a very small % gain of overall power (1.9%). Some, but not all include: Ambient Temp, Barometric pressure, Fuel flow, Octane, Alternator Output, each line of code in the DME operating w/o fault on each run, Engine Temp, Tranny Temp, Bearing Temp, and on and on.

For example, an Alternator (whose power draw is variable and not constant) alone can draw as much as 4-30 crank HP because of the inefficiencies in a Belt & Pulley system, so if it was filling demand on the 1st run, but not the 2nd, this alone could account for the variance seen.

The best method is to do multiple runs exactly duplicating the conditions of all previous runs and then averaging the results. Then, you reverse it, put the snorkel back on and see if you consistently achieve the previous Baseline numbers over an average of multiple runs. If these results aren't duplicated to within a pretty narrow degree, there is some variable not being accounted for.

Just because you get a graph from a single run which supports your theory, isn't in, and of, itself proof of anything...

Happy Motoring!... Jim'99