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Old 09-12-2010, 04:53 AM   #1
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Advice on Paint desire better than new

Any reccomendations on how to specify a re-paint of a 1999 boxster 986. I am looking to complete a high end resoration of my 986 and would like to re-paint in black in a way that it looks as good or better than the new black porsches.

does anyone know what they use to paint new porsches this days?

PPG or DuPont paints - what system - can anyshop do it?

How much top coat ect .....
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Old 09-12-2010, 06:04 AM   #2
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Not many shops will be able to repaint your car better than the factory. Those that can will charge a lot of money. Ask around your car community for the best body shops and see what they say. Then talk with each of them.
If you have a Porsche, Ferrari, Bently, etc. dealer in town you may also call them to see who they use.
If you're restoring your 986 I'm guessing you'll spend more money on the restoration process than what the car is worth now.
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Old 09-12-2010, 06:45 AM   #3
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Expense not investment

Yea i know the restoration is more than value, but 1 - i never considered this car would be anything other than an expense, i.e. it is not an investment. 2- I do not plan on selling it 3 - i just put a new engine in it less than 10K miles ago.

and 3 - I have found allthough the concept of trading up, for example in stead of putting 15 k in new engine and 4 K in new paint and leather sell car for 10 K and take the $25k to trade up to a newer Boxster makes sense - once you get your new car you just want to start customizing the engine, suspension, paint and leather anyway.

I found people are happier with a car they have customized or restored regardless of the fact they have invested far more than it is worth. After all if it was just performance per dollar we all probably should be driving some sort of car from Japan, or dare i say it? ... a corvette!

Ouch that hurt, I am sorry I take it back ....
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Old 09-12-2010, 07:00 AM   #4
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Originally Posted by sturgedm
Yea i know the restoration is more than value, but 1 - i never considered this car would be anything other than an expense, i.e. it is not an investment. 2- I do not plan on selling it 3 - i just put a new engine in it less than 10K miles ago.

and 3 - I have found allthough the concept of trading up, for example in stead of putting 15 k in new engine and 4 K in new paint and leather sell car for 10 K and take the $25k to trade up to a newer Boxster makes sense - once you get your new car you just want to start customizing the engine, suspension, paint and leather anyway.

I found people are happier with a car they have customized or restored regardless of the fact they have invested far more than it is worth. After all if it was just performance per dollar we all probably should be driving some sort of car from Japan, or dare i say it? ... a corvette!

Ouch that hurt, I am sorry I take it back ....
Where are you located ? Maybe someone on the forum can recommend an excellent "painter".
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Old 09-12-2010, 07:11 AM   #5
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In Chester County, PA - Delaware PCA member

I am South of Philadelphia, and North of Wilmington Delaware. Member of Delaware's PCA.
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Old 09-12-2010, 07:24 AM   #6
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Originally Posted by sturgedm
I am South of Philadelphia, and North of Wilmington Delaware. Member of Delaware's PCA.
Thats interesting, my vehicle came from southern Delaware. In any case, if you are willing to travel, I can recommend a phenomenal "painter" up here in Massachusetts.
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Old 09-12-2010, 07:50 AM   #7
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Be prepared to spend $8-10k for a complete repaint including door jams and compartment interiors. You didn't mention if you're changing color.

Dupont and PPG both make excellent quality paints, but any shop that does this on high end cars will be using a good paint. The real quality is in the preparation and application, even more so than in the materials themselves.

A really good paint job will include stripping off all of the existing paint and starting from base metal with compatible primers and fillers. They'll put on several coats of clear and color (wet) sand and polish until the car is a colored mirror.

When you look at shops, insist on seeing the work they've done on other cars and have them step you through their process. After you go through a few shops, you'll get an idea of who's really putting the effort in and who isn't.

By the way, some of the most impressive painters I've found work out of small garages at their homes.

Check out the two attached pictures. The Rx-7 has a pretty decent paint job, it was about $8k several years ago. The reflection of the Boxster in the Rx-7 is pretty clear and smooth.



Now look at the Rx-7 in the Boxster and see how wavy it is. The Boxster is the factory job.


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Old 09-12-2010, 07:59 AM   #8
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Originally Posted by blue2000s
Be prepared to spend $8-10k for a complete repaint including door jams and compartment interiors. You didn't mention if you're changing color.

Dupont and PPG both make excellent quality paints, but any shop that does this on high end cars will be using a good paint. The real quality is in the preparation and application, even more so than in the materials themselves.
I would say $8-10K easy. And thats assuming, that the original color is going to stay the same, and that there is no real damage that has to be repaired. Also, I agree with Blue 2000s regarding quality work that can be found coming out of "small garages". In all my years as a car enthusiast, finding a skilled "painter" has always proven to be one of the most difficult tasks. Over the years, I have seen literally "concours" quality paint work and restoration emerge from some of the most spartan and basic of shops. On the other hand, I have witness utter "crap" being pushed out the doors of some of the most sophisticated facilities.
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Old 09-12-2010, 09:19 AM   #9
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Don't limit yourself to DuPont or PPG. BASF, ICI, Spies Hecker, Sherwin Williams Automotive, Sikkens, are all top quality.

If you wait too long, you will be faced with the possibility of having to find a shop that does waterborne paints.

The undisputed leader is BASF Glasurit 90 Line. They have been developing this line for over 20 years.

If you are in California waterborne is all that CARB allows. It's much higher strength tints mean less color needs to be applied for total coverage.

But like previously stated it's all in the application and the pre-paint prep.

edit: I see you are in Pa. Joe from PA just had a front bumper replaced. He had high praise for a shop in West Chester,Pa.

Here's a link...
Front Bumper replaced - Quick story, bodyshop plug, and pictures to come

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Old 09-12-2010, 09:49 AM   #10
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You guys are awesome

Hey all thank you for the feed back.

I am right outside of West Chester, PA so that works if you can get me the name of the shop.

I am also in Mass allot for work so Mass shops work for me as well.

The car is black, and will stay black.

I will up load picture. Body is almost pefect. It is my clear coat that is really swirled up by buffers and such ... and the exterior plastics bits are showing the "whiting" that comes with age and UV damage "plastisizer blooming."
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Old 09-12-2010, 10:05 AM   #11
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What do you think?

Here are the pictures of my 99 black, fresh 2.5 engine, now trying to get new leather, top and paint....

I love this care right up untill i pick it up or drop it off at dealer for work, and sitting next to the new Boxsters the paint looks sooooo tired ...

Hence my requests for advice on better than new paint jobs ....

Again it can stay black, i really just want all the exterior done, all ruber and plastic exterior gaskets, bumper covers and grills replaced for new .....
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Old 09-12-2010, 10:07 AM   #12
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Originally Posted by sturgedm
Hey all thank you for the feed back.

I am right outside of West Chester, PA so that works if you can get me the name of the shop.

I am also in Mass allot for work so Mass shops work for me as well.

The car is black, and will stay black.

I will up load picture. Body is almost pefect. It is my clear coat that is really swirled up by buffers and such ... and the exterior plastics bits are showing the "whiting" that comes with age and UV damage "plastisizer blooming."
If you are serious about using my contact up here in Massachusetts feel free to send me a private message. His work is unparalleled, and he is known throughout the area as one of the top custom painters and craftmans. Here's a couple of photos my vehicle. The work he did involved a full Hamann body kit and several other details. Not to sound immodest, but the vehicle won best in show the 3 times it was shown. Beating out many Carreras I might add !
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Old 09-12-2010, 11:47 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sturgedm
Here are the pictures of my 99 black, fresh 2.5 engine, now trying to get new leather, top and paint....

I love this care right up untill i pick it up or drop it off at dealer for work, and sitting next to the new Boxsters the paint looks sooooo tired ...

Hence my requests for advice on better than new paint jobs ....

Again it can stay black, i really just want all the exterior done, all ruber and plastic exterior gaskets, bumper covers and grills replaced for new .....
Depending on if you really want a show quality paint job or just your car to look better, you have some choices.

If your clear coat isn't peeling and you just want to smooth out the finish, you may want to just consider having a body shop or detailer do a thorough polishing. That should be enough to smooth out swirl marks and make things look much better. The final stage of a good paint job is a multi-step polish that really brings out the car's luster. They can do the same with an older paint job if it's still in good shape.

The issue is, if you have swirl marks now, and you don't change the way you take care of the car's finish, you'll have swirl marks with the new paint job and end out where you are now but with a good chunk of change missing from your wallet.

Unless you paint the plastic, there's nothing the body shop is going to do to freshen it up anyway. Fading plastic can be re-dyed to look like new. There's a product called forever black that you might want to look into.
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Old 09-12-2010, 02:19 PM   #14
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plastic fantastic ....

I am going to have the old plastic thrown out ... and all those parts replaced with new parts .... that should work ...right?

.... same with seals ....

Yea I will be more carefull after the repaint, the guys i take it to sugested the repaint because they thought after 11 years of polishing there was not enough "clear coat" left ... (he said its real thin?)

...and again the new Porsches really have some great paint jobs. Even when I use the same guys my dealer uses to polish, I just can not get my 10 year old paint to look like that new GT3 in the window.

Plastic I will go new, outside mirrows I will go with mini copper black and white checker flag.

and for the coupe de gras (sp? i dont know no french) i want to do the lower door area in the inverse of the new boxsters as seen here ....

Then I will enter myt Boxster in contests and win them all just like Johnny Danger after that I will take over the WORLD!

... or at least i will have a really cool looking Boxster ... taking over the WORLD probably involves more than just a great paint job ... but maybe if I add the TPC supercharger .... ahh dare to dream!
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Old 09-12-2010, 02:40 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnny Danger
If you are serious about using my contact up here in Massachusetts feel free to send me a private message. His work is unparalleled, and he is known throughout the area as one of the top custom painters and craftmans. Here's a couple of photos my vehicle. The work he did involved a full Hamann body kit and several other details. Not to sound immodest, but the vehicle won best in show the 3 times it was shown. Beating out many Carreras I might add !

Johnny D ... can you tell us all the wheel specs you have on your boxster ... they aint no 17 x 8.5 and i want what you are running. Please tell, i'd hate to have to steal yours
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Old 09-12-2010, 07:29 PM   #16
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Originally Posted by sturgedm
I am going to have the old plastic thrown out ... and all those parts replaced with new parts .... that should work ...right?

.... same with seals ....

Yea I will be more carefull after the repaint, the guys i take it to sugested the repaint because they thought after 11 years of polishing there was not enough "clear coat" left ... (he said its real thin?)

...and again the new Porsches really have some great paint jobs. Even when I use the same guys my dealer uses to polish, I just can not get my 10 year old paint to look like that new GT3 in the window.

Plastic I will go new, outside mirrows I will go with mini copper black and white checker flag.

and for the coupe de gras (sp? i dont know no french) i want to do the lower door area in the inverse of the new boxsters as seen here ....

Then I will enter myt Boxster in contests and win them all just like Johnny Danger after that I will take over the WORLD!

... or at least i will have a really cool looking Boxster ... taking over the WORLD probably involves more than just a great paint job ... but maybe if I add the TPC supercharger .... ahh dare to dream!
Why is the clear coat so thin? Has there been a lot of polishing done with an orbital buffer? If not, there should be plenty of clear to have a good (not all pros are good) detailing done. If it is in fair condition, a top-shelf detail will make it better than new. Yes, BETTER than new. Honestly. The good guys use a tool to measure the thickness of the paint in many places before doing any work. They then have an idea what they are working with and can select appropriate products and procedures.
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Old 09-12-2010, 07:39 PM   #17
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Johnny D ... can you tell us all the wheel specs you have on your boxster ... they aint no 17 x 8.5 and i want what you are running. Please tell, i'd hate to have to steal yours
They are one piece forged Champion RS-98's, (f) 19x8 +31 offset (r) 19x10 +31 offset.
Tires are Goodyear F1's (f)235/35/19 and (r) 275/30/19.
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Old 09-13-2010, 05:54 AM   #18
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I understand the desire to change all the rubber and plastic bits, contemplated it myself, but have you priced out what it will cost to do that?? I used the Forever Black on my 99 and I'm really impressed with the results. If you do a few apps, lightly buffing in between, the plastic will have a deep rich better-than-new shine, especially after a coat of wax. I used Mothers Back to Black on the cowl under the wiper blades and that also worked well, but more of a flat black finish, and it needs to be re-done from time to time.

Btw, and this is obviously totally personal preference and I would never want to criticize someone else's customization choices, but I think those checkered flag side mirrors would look really tacky on a black Box. Might work on a white or yellow one.

Your car looks really nice in the pic. The paint may be a bit tired but a good polishing should bring it back to life. If you dump $8K on paint then you will spend your life agonizing over every stone chip, bug splat, and polishing swirl you see. Daily drivers have scars - wear them with pride!
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Old 09-13-2010, 06:54 AM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sturgedm
Hey all thank you for the feed back.

I am right outside of West Chester, PA so that works if you can get me the name of the shop.

If you click on the link I posted the name of the shop is in the second paragraph.
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