Soft Top Mechanism Just Failed

[BFeller]

Title says it - now it's time to figure out what happened.

I went to put the top up and failed. The clam shell started up, then there was a pop and it went back down. It hasn't moved since. I looked at the control rod on the drivers side. It has come apart. The bolt that allows for the length adjustment has fallen out. I could see into in the foam trays. I disconnected the rest of that side. Next I removed the ball socket on the passenger side. I have to go back and figure out the how and where to remove the next connection in order to lift the clam shell. I have popped the clam shell arms out of the ball joints that are near the doors - only to realize that appears to be wrong. Reading the 101 Projects book and the Bentley manual seem to show a ball joint and socket the other end. Which might explain why the clam shell will not lift. I want to lift the clam shell in order to place the soft top into the service position. That should allow me to check for any other damage.

The previous owner told me that drivers side ball joints had cracked and failed. His mechanic replaced the it with the newer white plastic version. The rubber gasket in that joint is trashed and needs to be replaced.

I have pulled up the renntech 10 page discussion on tops linked in previous post on this forum. I am off to do some reading.

This whole thing blows up my plan to go for a ride in the Blue Ridge mountains this weekend.

[BFeller]

Based on what I am reading it looks like my transmission drive levers rotated 180 degrees out of position

Here is a picture of the drivers side - notice how the longest side faces the door with the clam shell closed. The passenger side is in the same position

[Nine8Six]

I had the very same failure (twice) and after spending almost $1500 to get it fixed, it failed a third time. I was reimbursed by the installer (less the parts) and feel very bad about this. I now "manually" open/close the roof. So much faster and quieter. Literally takes me 5secs to get the roof in/out and it is failed proof.

Silly mechanism!

[Nine8Six]

The last failure bent the clamshell on one side (see on the pic).

You will need to pay me a lot of dosh to convince me to replace anything related to this auto-open-roof thing ever again

It stays like that until the car dies lol

[stjoh]

Originally Posted by BFeller

Title says it - now it's time to figure out what happened.

I went to put the top up and failed. The clam shell started up, then there was a pop and it went back down. It hasn't moved since. I looked at the control rod on the drivers side. It has come apart. The bolt that allows for the length adjustment has fallen out. I could see into in the foam trays. I disconnected the rest of that side. Next I removed the ball socket on the passenger side. I have to go back and figure out the how and where to remove the next connection in order to lift the clam shell. I have popped the clam shell arms out of the ball joints that are near the doors - only to realize that appears to be wrong. Reading the 101 Projects book and the Bentley manual seem to show a ball joint and socket the other end. Which might explain why the clam shell will not lift. I want to lift the clam shell in order to place the soft top into the service position. That should allow me to check for any other damage.

The previous owner told me that drivers side ball joints had cracked and failed. His mechanic replaced the it with the newer white plastic version. The rubber gasket in that joint is trashed and needs to be replaced.

I have pulled up the renntech 10 page discussion on tops linked in previous post on this forum. I am off to do some reading.

This whole thing blows up my plan to go for a ride in the Blue Ridge mountains this weekend.

I have a motor and drive mechanism in case you need it. I'm also in NC BTW.

[rfuerst911sc]

Originally Posted by Nine8Six

I had the very same failure (twice) and after spending almost $1500 to get it fixed, it failed a third time. I was reimbursed by the installer (less the parts) and feel very bad about this. I now "manually" open/close the roof. So much faster and quieter. Literally takes me 5secs to get the roof in/out and it is failed proof.

Silly mechanism!

What did you do to make it a manual top ? Is it just a matter of disconnection the rod ends ?

[BFeller]

It is completely apart. I had to pull the little clips on black metal arms. I used a cooter pin removal tool to manipulate the clips into a position that allowed for removal. It only took two cut fingers before I put on the mechanics glove to spare the other eight.

The motor is running, the transmissions arms rotate forward and backwards. It does look like the pivot arm that attaches to the top, the one with the replaced ball socket, is slightly twisted. I can't say whether it happened when the bolt came out, or if it was from the previous owners incident. It is a subtle twist, in a part that already has some twist. I will order a replacement. I want to check the microswitches to make sure everything is shutting off when it should. It appears, that maybe the one that shuts motor off when the clam shell closes, failed and allowed the motor to beyond a safe limit. I need to figure that out. I think that would be the function of the switch/lever on the top of the motor.

[BFeller]

Originally Posted by Nine8Six

The last failure bent the clamshell on one side (see on the pic).

You will need to pay me a lot of dosh to convince me to replace anything related to this auto-open-roof thing ever again

It stays like that until the car dies lol

How do you keep the clamshell from rattling? I certianly will drive this with the mechanism disconnected if that is not an issue. 3000 miles since I bought the car a few weeks ago. I am hooked bad......

[BFeller]

Originally Posted by stjoh

I have a motor and drive mechanism in case you need it. I'm also in NC BTW.

Thanks for the offer. Have any other parts - your not actually near Rocky Mount are you? Because I knew we had river in NC named the Toe, towns named Dallas and Star, but not one called Albuquerque. H

[CoBeerToad]

Just snapped my second pair of connecting rods this morning. I just ordered a bunch of bushings a few days ago. I'm going to give it one more shot and carefully disassemble everything and put it back together. If it fails again, I'm joining the manual top club.

[Nine8Six]

Originally Posted by rfuerst911sc

What did you do to make it a manual top ? Is it just a matter of disconnection the rod ends ?

Correct. Just need to disconnect both side rods and it goes free.

So much faster. Lift the clam shell with one hand, retract the roof with the other, drop the clam shell, and off you go (5-7secs).

[Nine8Six]

Originally Posted by BFeller

How do you keep the clamshell from rattling? I certianly will drive this with the mechanism disconnected if that is not an issue. 3000 miles since I bought the car a few weeks ago. I am hooked bad......

lol that open roof feature is indeed a nice one.

The clam is heavy enough on its own to stay in place. No rattling or anything. There is a hollow compartment underneath it where you can place a weight of some sort if you feel the need too.

Since that picture above I've placed a 2kg piece of carbon steel to add some weight to the side that is bent just so it closes flush. All looking good now but all a very tacky set-up. But again, I refuse to try to get it fixed 'again' and I have no time (and lost patience) to do it myself.

Love my manual roof!

[BFeller]

Yep - I used the car today in manual roof mode. I did get some rattling. For piece of mind nylon webbing with a buckle went around the arm on side. If it had tried to pop open - it would not have gone far.

I need to trace why the motor does not shut down once the clamshell closes. The roof in motion light no longer shuts off (it was earlier this morning). Of course, every now and again the windows would drop like the roof was starting in motion when going over a sharp bump.

[rfuerst911sc]

Originally Posted by Nine8Six

Correct. Just need to disconnect both side rods and it goes free.

So much faster. Lift the clam shell with one hand, retract the roof with the other, drop the clam shell, and off you go (5-7secs).

So at any time you or anyone else can lift the clamshell ? The only thing holding down the clamshell is its weight ? Just curious in case mine takes a crap

[Nine8Six]

Originally Posted by rfuerst911sc

So at any time you or anyone else can lift the clamshell ? The only thing holding down the clamshell is its weight ? Just curious in case mine takes a crap

Correct. Mind you it also means you can unlatch & lift the rear window, place it in service mode type position, and get a skinny 10 years old kid inside the car with no problem. Perfect backdoor for when you forget your keys in the car

[Eric G]

You can also do this if you are worried about the clam shell...just saying...

http://986forum.com/forums/general-discussions/43235-why-i-converted-manual-top.html

[Nine8Six]

Oh... ok. that was kinda of a cool idea Eric

Guess the 97 I got from Germany were made of old style sheet metal and have heavier clamshell. Mine shuts just fine, never moved up an inch while driving and that's on the stiff-as-hell M30RoW suspension kit from Porsche :/ neither rattled during idling. dunno

[N0tt0N]

Originally Posted by Nine8Six

Oh... ok. that was kinda of a cool idea Eric

Guess the 97 I got from Germany were made of old style sheet metal and have heavier clamshell. Mine shuts just fine, never moved up an inch while driving and that's on the stiff-as-hell M30RoW suspension kit from Porsche :/ neither rattled during idling. dunno

I figured you had already hooked the clamshell up to the brake and spoiler circuitry so that it opens up above 100KPH when you step on the brake like a Veyron or McLaren

[Eric G]

Originally Posted by Nine8Six

Oh... ok. that was kinda of a cool idea Eric

Guess the 97 I got from Germany were made of old style sheet metal and have heavier clamshell. Mine shuts just fine, never moved up an inch while driving and that's on the stiff-as-hell M30RoW suspension kit from Porsche :/ neither rattled during idling. dunno

Mine was good in traffic around town but on the twisties in the mountains with bumps frost heaves, it would go whumpity whumpity (that is a scientifically proven descriptor for my car).

[Nine8Six]

Originally Posted by N0tt0N

I figured you had already hooked the clamshell up to the brake and spoiler circuitry so that it opens up above 100KPH when you step on the brake like a Veyron or McLaren

Unlike the McLaren and Veyron, I think Lambo also uses active air spoilers as well?, mine is only hooked up to the temp gauge, not the brake system like theirs (unique!). Lift up when cold air is needed in the engine bay...works well.

How did you manage to spot that?!