Spark plug tubes
 

I am a new owner and have been lurking on the board for a while now doing research and coming up with project ideas and looking for troubleshooting tips.

I have read about spark plug tube removal by many members and tried to do it this past weekend without success. I used the rubber expansion mechanism to try to pull the tubes, I tried the long bolt with a washer on the end, and even fashioned a lever cap out of a pvc cap that applies pulling force straight out of the block to avoid the screwdriver prying move. The frigging tubes will not release! I can get them to turn in the block but they will not pop out!

Any other tips or tricks?

I guess I am being stubborn and want to change the tubes but it is not a huge deal since I have determined my oil leak is from the rms and not the spark plug tubes.

Info on the car - 1997 box, 33,350 miles, I am 3rd owner, previous owner is family member that put 9,000 miles on the car in 15 years. Have all service records from family member and sleep well knowing the original owner drove it 25,000 miles in the first 18 months of its life.

Car is Silver with Boxster red interior, now has underdrive pulley and entirely updated audio system. I'll post some better pics when I take some good non-phone shots but this is her first night in the new home in Illinois after the relocation from Texas..

Thx[IMG]!http://986forum.com/forums/uploads01...1400066190.jpg[/IMG]

One additional bonus of Porsche ownership - you get to see this in the service bay - yes it is real! http://986forum.com/forums/uploads01...1400066484.jpg

I used this: Amazon.com: Moeller Snap-Tite Boat Bailer Plug (1-Inch, Brass): Sports & Outdoors If properly adjusted, it works fine. After snapping over the cam lever, I used a pair of pliers to pull it (and the spark plug tube) out.

You must have not made tool with the bolt correctly or used them right as I was able to remove tubes that even have been glued in with silicone with them. If the bolt idea don't work there is no way the transom idea will. There is no way you can put that much force with the transom tool.

Spark plug tubes are easy to do just pull the coil, don't forget remove the sparkplug, as well to pull the tubes out,

washer must be small enough to fit thru the tube so it can catch the edge when it is placed past the end...

https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/wu...9PUb=s209-p-no

Washer must be small enough to fit thru the smaller end of the tube.

bolt must be longer than the tube, but short enough you can put a prybar or pliers on the end...

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/v9...tPlH=s209-p-no



I just use a simple bolt a couple of washers, and a couple of nuts.

http://986forum.com/forums/attachmen...9206061365.jpg

Just make sure bolt is long enough and washer is small enough to fit in hole..

http://img.tapatalk.com/d/14/01/09/ura9ynyb.jpg

Drop the bolt in until you can feel the washer go past the last part of the lip on the tube...

http://img.tapatalk.com/d/14/01/09/uga4e4ev.jpg

Use a screwdriver and pry the tube out by placing tip under the washer as shown, notice the bolt is at a slight angle so the washer will catch the inside edge.

This tool allows for more force to be used to remove the tube and less breakage than using the transom plug idea.


http://img.tapatalk.com/d/14/01/09/y7ujyba5.jpg

I also had issues with the tube and tried many options listed above, what worked for me was a brake spring tool I had in my box:

http://i185.photobucket.com/albums/x...SpringTool.jpg

My tubes were so loose I could pull them out with my finger. Well at least the tubes that didn't come out when i pulled the coil. It's kinda nice not to smell burning oil anymore.

I actually have that tool (bent slightly different) and tried it as well, unfortunately on my siliconed tubes it actually broke the tube. :eek: lucky for me I got all the broken pieces out :)

Trying to figure how the bolt tool would not work and already sweating to death outside today. Porsche is still in the air so I thought I may try the tool again... Sorry kind of hard when you have to hold the camera too.


I think the trick is making sure the washer is beyond the bottom of the tube and putting the bolt at a angle so it will grab the bottom edge of the tube as well.

https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-k...239-MOTION.gif

the washer also needs to slightly smaller than 0.95 inch 0.90 shoulf be good.

https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-G...514_083006.jpg

Also made a very short vid too. will take some time to up load...

That looks like way tooooo much work.

Do yourself a favor and get a set up like this:

1) transom plug - $5

2) just about any old redundant socket you have lying around. Free!

Using a dremel notch the socket so that it securely fits the "T" handle on the transom plug..

Insert the transom plug into the spark plug tube and then ratchet the T on top the plug using the notched out socket. It will tighten and then breaks loose, easily pulled from the cam cover.

With this set up, it takes approximately 30secs to remove a spark plug tube.


http://986forum.com/forums/uploads01...1400092700.jpg

Really?
I guess my math is a little different than yours….

:rolleyes:
Hmmm… strange I think mine is in most people’s bolt drawer, no need to cut up a good socket, or spend the day to hunt down a transom plug…

Vs…


Insert tool then use pry bar and it pops out…

Uh which takes longer??? LOL :D

Vs. maybe not even twenty seconds, no trip to the store needed, and what happens when you have a spark plug tube that is stuck? I guess you would be SOL and have to go into the bolt drawer and make this tool for nothing I guess…. :rolleyes:

http://986forum.com/forums/attachmen...9206061365.jpg

Vs.

http://986forum.com/forums/uploads01...1400092700.jpg



But mine is not endorsed by Pedro…

Okay you win…

Here is the video for those interested.

my lil' invention... spark plug tube removal tool I made for Porsche - YouTube

http://youtu.be/KKPi4SDm3XE



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I'd have to agree with you Healthservices. I made your tool out of stuff from my junk drawer. But like I said above, my tubes were so bad half of them came out with the coils. So if anyone need a tube remover pm me :cheers:

I actually did not happen to have a bolt, nut and washers of those approximate dimensions just lying around, perhaps most do... but then I don't have a lift at the moment either, so I'm working on my back with limited space. I'm sure that you've done this more times than me so perhaps a more experienced person prefers the pry-bar method.

All of my tubes were original; the 2 that were leaking were the easiest to remove. The other 4 felt "stuck". When I used the transom plug method, the tube's seal was broken free via rotation, there was never a need to pull or pry in any way. I also like the fact that one is not concentrating all of force on one part of the tube, but they certainly seem robust enough to handle it.

I had no idea this was a Pedro endorsed method (not sure why that would cause snark). I saw transom plug here, and then modded a socket because it was the fastest way to actuate it.

Anyway, thanks for taking the time to make the video! Looks pretty easy to do. Did not mean to provoke all of the :rolleyes::rolleyes:... I'll be less harsh next time.

I am just trying to save people some time, money, and headaches thru my past mistakes. The bolt and washer method is available for purchase at a hardware store for less than a dollar if you do not have the spare nuts and bolts at home. There is no need to source a dremel either.

Yes, I too originally bought a transom plug to remove the tube. I also cut a socket to help expand the tool. As a matter of fact I actually had to make several trips to buy more as I had a tube that would not budge and the tool kept failing. The transom tool was tightened to the point the threads in the bolt that expanded the plug stripped. I even bought out and destroyed all the transom plugs the local store had. I then made my own version of a transom plug using a threaded bolt, washers, and the rubber from a transom plug. This still did not remove my glued in tubes. If you do a search there are people with issues with the transom tool. I’m sure 80% of the time the transom tool will work. So far the bolt and nut method has worked 100% of the time and less work for me. I’m sure if you really have a tool fetish you could buy something like this for $125…

http://illusionstool.com/images/016.jpg

Illusions Tool

To me the problem with a mechanical tool like that is, it can actually force the tube to expand making it even harder to remove from the hole.



http://board.moparts.org/ubbthreads/...mlins/pity.gif

I just used a piece of 3/4" black steel pipe (natural gas pipe). Thread it it the end of the tube and then use vice-grips to pull them out. Not very glamorous but it worked.

I used similar to this but it had a right angle and a female end too. Thread in a little and pull the tube out. When reinserting, use the other end to provide an even pushing force. I have a picture in one of my other threads. Even though you thread it in, it doesn't do much to the spark plug tube.

For all the searches I did when rebuilding mine I never ran across the both method. Really cool idea!!! I ended up using the transom method which did work, but the bolt method is an elegant way.

I've never seen this as a requirement for removing the spark plug tubes... is this the commonly accepted practice? (I didn't remove the plugs before changing out the tubes when I did this recently, and didn't have any issues, so I'm curious.)

If you are going to use the bolt method, the spark plug may be in the way... besides spark plugs are partially made of porcelain and the last thing you want to do is cause another issue. Better safe, than sorry.

Transom tool grabs from the top of the plastic tube, the bolt method grabs from the bottom edge of the tube.

Oh, right, of course - thanks.

A bit of a revised thread
Getting ready to order new plug tubes. Question to those who did this, do you do all 6 as a matter of course when only 1 or 2 actually leak?
I have 2 with minimal leaking, both driver's side, but I am of the mind set that I should just bite the bullet and do all 6

Also I'm ordering from Pelican:
Porsche originals, which need rubber seals separately
Or non-Porsche which include rubber seals

Opinions welcome

I got the ones with the rings. I also replaced all six. Cheap enough to do them all, because the ones that aren't leaking now will sooner than later i figured.

I did all 6 even though only 2 (the front ones) were seeping badly. I got the ones from Pelican that had the O-rings included, that were non Porsche brand, the ones for $5.25 that were "German".

When I had the car at a shop earlier this year they told me I had leaking at both sides, less than 1,000 miles after replacing them. I think they saw residue from when they were seeping before (I didn't really clean up that good but I did clean underneath where it was dripping down to and haven't seen any new oil there). I haven't had a chance to get in there and see for myself but I will do so the next time I have the rear wheels off. They said that the Porsche O-rings were the best. But if you buy the Porsche tubes off Pelican you have to get the O-rings separately and they sell the Victor Reinz O-rings. Auto Atlanta sells the Porsche O-rings and tubes as well.

If I had to do them again because they were still leaking I would spring for the more expensive Porsche ones, but I think mine are fine and the tech was just seeing the residue from the previous seepage.

If I cheap out (I do that a lot...) I replace as a minimum, just the 12 - O rings if not all the tubes with the o rings. but I always replace all.

Here's my el-cheapo tube removal and re-insertion tools, made from what I found laying around:

http://986forum.com/forums/uploads01...1412007496.jpg
http://986forum.com/forums/uploads01...1412007515.jpg
http://986forum.com/forums/uploads01...1412007530.jpg

I just turn the pvc cap into the tube for a few turns, then grab it and yank.

The wood block is used to pop the new tube in.

Here's what a 119k km (75k mile) 13 year-old o-ring looks like compared to a new one (on the right). Hopefully that explains my leaks.

The width of the o-ring groove on the tube looks overly generous, allowing spreading of the o-ring. A narrower groove might keep the o-ring effective for longer.

http://986forum.com/forums/uploads01...1412007833.jpg

I use a rubber core to a drill-press cylinder sander. It was so-so until I realized I could put a small piece of sand-paper around the core and then expand it and *bam*.....easy as can be.

I like the wood block idea to push them back in. Busted my knuckles up a bit when I just used my fingers.

Congrats on the new to you Boxster. I have a 99 same colors and the HT and speedster humps. I tried to remove the tubes with mixed results. I bought the transom plug from a boat supplier it worked for all but one. I tried to use a screw driver to get stubborn one out and broke a piece off and fell into the engine. Since my valve covers were leaking anyway had it towed to mechanic and had him replace valve cover gasket and get piece of plastic out while doing so. My experience is 1) dealer replacement tubes are much better quality than the no-name brands 2) it is recommended that the engine be warm and therefore tubes are warm prior to removing and I would agree (I did not heed this advice) 3) transom plug would have worked better had engine been warmed up and had a slotted socket to tighten the transom plug also it worked much better once I wrapped a piece of sand paper around it to get a bite on the inner part of the tube. I think the method I would use is the bolt and washer seems to me to have a better chance of not damaging the tube. But hindsight is always 20/20. Keep us posted!

I used a pair of snap ring pliers that expand when you squeeze the handles. It may crack your old tube if you are too forceful but i just gave mine a circular motion when squeezing along with pulling and mine popped right out.

I am a noob to Porsche maintenance (though not to car and engine work in general)

I have oil all over my head cover area (both sides) and am having to add 1 litre of oil every 300 miles or so, so I ordered a tube of sealant to refit the head covers, a set of plug tubes and seals. It's a 2002 Boxster S by the way.

having found this thread I suspect I might have wasted some money on the sealant. Do you good folks think just replacing my plug tubes will fix the problem or do I actually need to remove, clean and refit my head covers? (I mean is it likely all my oil loss is from the plug tubes/O-rings?)

If I fitted the tubes and seals and found that my head covers were leaking would the plug tubes be reusable or need replacing again?

No sealant is used when installing the sparkplug tubes so yes they can be reused


Please note that if you decide to remove the valve cover there is a danger of the cams falling out without something to hold the cams in place. And yes you can make a simple tool to hold those in too.

If that much oil leaks out every 300kms you must be able to see where its coming from... if not wash the outer cam shells off (or spray them down good with brake clean) and see where the oil comes from.... If the tubes leak just replace the tubes (they should come with new O-rings) The old rings get hard after a while and don't seal well... common issue... IF the oil is leaking at the cam shell seam itself you will need a proper cam hold down tool before you attempt to loosen off the shell (its not just a cover) as its actually the outer support housing for the cams.
H

Thanks for the info guys you've saved me from making a serious mistake!

I'll change the tubes, clean the engine up, monitor oil level and look for signs of further leaks.

Another happy bolt user here. Had a leftover 6" lag bolt from my deck project and sandwiched an oil drain plug gasket between 2 nuts. Worked great. Was able to remove all tubes safely, installed new o-rings, then re-install tubes. Make sure the engine is warm and pry at an angle like healthservices said. Thanks healthservices!

If anyone needs the tool to hold their cams when valve covers (sorry, i can't adapt to calling them head covers) are off, i have the one i created during my engine tear down. It works perfectly.

Drop me a pm with address

There are some very useful comments by JFP on the Spark Plug Tube Seal leakage issue here:
https://www.renntech.org/forums/topic/50967-spark-plug-tube-seal-leaks/?_fromLogin=1#replyForm
I have recently had to research this issue exhaustively and JFP's comments are to be found no where else that I found.

O ring lube
 

Be sure and lubricate the new O rings with proper O ring lubricant, not motor oil. Instead of the super expensive Porsche brand lubricant I used Parker Super O ring lubricant.....get a tube and you will be surprised at how often you use it in the shop. oil Changes or any time an O ring is in use

Note on lubricating O ring seals -see link above.
Use silicone grease. Don't use engine oil because it is not as slippery,nor as thixotropic.
Do NOT lubricate the entire seal,nor the groove in the tube . Fit the seals to the tube DRY .
Lubricate just the leading edge and outer surface of the seal sparingly. Otherwise the seal will twist and roll as you push it in the final 2mm. That would probably leak .If the seal slides out of the groove(because it is oily) in the tube, it will also leak.
Measure the leading edge groove in the tube for out of round before you fit the seal. A difference of 1/2mm may cause a leak.
If you use sealant of any sort, you will be doomed to leaks and worse.

And be very careful with aftermarket tubes, many of them vary wildly in both size and concentricity as users have found to their dismay. Cheap ain't always a positive.

At 120k miles, I changed my 2001 boxster 2.7's spark plugs yesterday, and replaced all the tube o-rings, whether they were leaking or not (to reduce chance of future leakage). Below in-flight picture offers a glimpse at the carnage... :o
http://986forum.com/forums/uploads02...1503978387.jpg

To remove the tubes, I used the T-handle, rubber expansion "transom plug" discussed above. I didn't make the special tool to tighten the handle with a wrench - just used my hands. (I may have a bit more forearm strength than average, though, and my fingers are sore now... lol!)

Initially, I tried tightening and then pulling on the handle. This never worked, and the plug always slipped out of the tube (I had cleaned the interior of the tube, so it was dry.). What worked was to keep tightening the t-handle until the tube rotated. This broke the static friction of the o-rings free, and then the tube would practically fall right out if even the smallest outward force was applied. The transom plug preserved the original (genuine Porsche) tubes, so they could be re-used. I just replaced the o-rings on mine (using genuine Porsche o-rings, which weren't as expensive as one might guess!)

I feel cleaning and lubricating the conical and cylindrical outer o-ring sealing surface on the cylinder head is imporant, so I did that, in addition to lubricating the outer surfaces of the o-rings discussed here (although I just used motor oil, rather than silicone grease discussed here). The new tubes just snapped right into place by hand - no tools required, no drama.

Most of my time was spent cleaning parts. The cylinder head covers were filthy. Didn't get a "before" picture, but here's sort of an after:
http://986forum.com/forums/uploads02...1503978505.jpg
Having these surfaces cleaned will make any future wrenching around these areas of the car so much more enjoyable!

I also cleaned and closely inspected the coil packs. They all looked perfect - no cracks and pretty indistinguishable from brand new after being cleaned up. A couple however, had damaged rubber lip, which I got a picture of and part number, but if the only purpose of the lip is to guide onto the plug, it may not be important to replace:
http://986forum.com/forums/uploads02...1503978636.jpg
Thoughts?

The old spark plugs were absolutely horrendous to remove. Dry, squeaking, carbon-contaminated threads. Probably coked up oil, from the plug sealing washer not working perfectly. Required nearly as much "free-removal" torque, as the initial break-away! I was relieved there was no galled aluminum in the threads of the removed plugs.
http://986forum.com/forums/uploads02...1503978840.jpg

On the new plugs, I used a light coating of anti-seize. Whoever at Bosch is recommending installing these plugs dry, should be shot. (Why wouldn't anti-size, with the metallic particles, conduct electricity?). The new plugs with light anti-seize coating hand-threaded in, and brought up to full torque spec like a dream! And the car also is running like a dream...
http://986forum.com/forums/uploads02...1503979124.jpg

The old plugs had noticeable worn "conical shaped" center electrodes, (below shown below next to fresh plug), and the side electrodes were also burned away a little bit.
http://986forum.com/forums/uploads02...1503979410.jpg
The wear maybe a bit much, or acceptable at time of replacement? Usually, the engine didn't seem to have any missing problem...

On the passenger side, I encountered one torn boot on the coil electrical connector:
http://986forum.com/forums/uploads02...1503979246.jpg
What would be required to replace this? (Is replacement boot available or need whole harness)

I put a little dielectric grease on both the spark plug electrical terminal, and the male coil pack connector conductors. I did some other maintenance work at pretty close to the same time, the car is running stronger than ever now. Maybe waiting this long (120k, and not sure if these plugs were ever replaced by previous owner) is too long to replace? Jacking the car up, and removing all the shields and rear tires required to access the plugs makes the job a bit not-so-simple. Glad to have it done!

Spark Plug Tube Seals or 'O' Rings
 

The one size fits all removal tool suggestion may not work.
I have used several different brands of 'O' rings. They vary in 2 important ways.
1. Out of the packet they may vary in thickness,i.d. and o.d. between brands.
2. Some swell substantially after just a few heat cycles.
This may explain why many find the transom plug tool useless.
The tool that always works - even with swollen seals is the long bolt plus washer.
The easiest seal+tube combo I have encountered is OEM Porsche. The 'fatest' ,most difficult are URO. But the URO sure did not leak ! But wow ,the force required to extract was alarming.
The long bolt + washer will always work, the Transom Plug only sometimes.