De-snorkeled my Box 5 minutes max

[JFP in PA]

Originally Posted by Boxtaboy

I've heard that theory about the snork being placed there to meet the stringent sound limitations in certain countries, but I then wonder why that type of snork tube is inserted in many different types of cars, even domestic ones.... you find them in the older air cooled 911s, in Mazda pickups, all sorts of cars....they all have snorks leading to their intakes. Therefore, I would think that there was a reason for them being there (maybe one function is to further quell sound), but there has to be another benefit to them, no? In fact, I would bet that you could get the Boxster up to higher speeds without even realizing the louder noise of the desnork because the extra growl from the desnork doesn't even come on until after 4k+ rpms really. This is why I don't think the snork is there solely for the purpose of noise abatement.

Actually, it is for noise abatement, and different OEM’s handle the issue in various ways. We currently have a Nissan product in the shop that has two factory options: A really slick cold air system and a large diameter, low restriction stainless steel exhausts system. Because the car came from the factory with these, there are two small decals on the radiator support noting that “the car is not legal for export to certain European countries”, because both the intake and exhaust fail to meet “TUV noise standards”. The non option version of the same car has a plastic box in the intake system with a similar baffle to the one on the Boxster inside of it, if you disconnect the box; you get a pronounced intake “roar”, much like the cold air system has. Interestingly, the optional cold air system, which while simple, is beautifully designed, adds 8-10 HP at the wheels, and the exhaust another 10-12 over the standard stuff, so the addition of these does make a significant difference.

The Swiss must drive the OEM’s nuts with this stuff………..

[Boxtaboy]

Originally Posted by JFP in PA

Actually, it is for noise abatement, and different OEM’s handle the issue in various ways. We currently have a Nissan product in the shop that has two factory options: A really slick cold air system and a large diameter, low restriction stainless steel exhausts system. Because the car came from the factory with these, there are two small decals on the radiator support noting that “the car is not legal for export to certain European countries”, because both the intake and exhaust fail to meet “TUV noise standards”. The non option version of the same car has a plastic box in the intake system with a similar baffle to the one on the Boxster inside of it, if you disconnect the box; you get a pronounced intake “roar”, much like the cold air system has. Interestingly, the optional cold air system, which while simple, is beautifully designed, adds 8-10 HP at the wheels, and the exhaust another 10-12 over the standard stuff, so the addition of these does make a significant difference.

The Swiss must drive the OEM’s nuts with this stuff………..

Cool, then all I have to figure out is a way to block out the waffle voids in my intake area, design a bigger curved scoop, and I'll have put that 2hp back into my car!

[JFP in PA]

Originally Posted by Boxtaboy

Cool, then all I have to figure out is a way to block out the waffle voids in my intake area, design a bigger curved scoop, and I'll have put that 2hp back into my car!

Intake systems can be funny things, they often respond rather differently than you might expect. We once were running an engine on a dyno cell stand (no car), and made pulls with and without an air filter, only to find it made more power with the air filter in place. One would assume that without the filter, the system should flow more air, but while the A/F ratio remained pretty stable, output dropped. It liked the filter, go figure……………..

[mptoledo]

wasn't the other reason for the snork to keep debri out? I have heard the lit cigarette example more than once. I noticed the small pan at the front of the snork looks like it is to keep out stuff.

Either way I will do my own unscientific analysis and let you know. I did read boxtaboy's reply on another thread as I was researching it. I can't see how letting more air in a less restrictive manner can cause a reduction in HP or MPG. Oh, well as jeff has said on numerous occasion, this dead horse has been beaten enough. Thanks for the input.

[Boxtaboy]

Originally Posted by mptoledo

wasn't the other reason for the snork to keep debri out? I have heard the lit cigarette example more than once. I noticed the small pan at the front of the snork looks like it is to keep out stuff.

Either way I will do my own unscientific analysis and let you know. I did read boxtaboy's reply on another thread as I was researching it. I can't see how letting more air in a less restrictive manner can cause a reduction in HP or MPG. Oh, well as jeff has said on numerous occasion, this dead horse has been beaten enough. Thanks for the input.

I think if you want to do an unscientific analysis, you can just do some timed runs on the freeway (where the airflow will be important), from 50-90mph, for example, with and then without the snork. That, I think, would be a pretty good measurement of what the snork actually does. Personally, I think you'll find that the snork will help your times, but I could be wrong. I hope I'm wrong, cause my snork is out. LOL

[JFP in PA]

Originally Posted by mptoledo

wasn't the other reason for the snork to keep debri out? I have heard the lit cigarette example more than once. I noticed the small pan at the front of the snork looks like it is to keep out stuff.

Nope, it is a noise baffle. If you really stop a moment and look at the opening in the body with the grill removed and the “snorkel” still in place, a whole lot of stuff can get passed it, so as a debris preventative, it would be pretty poor; you’d be a lot better off with some simple mesh for that purpose………….

[mptoledo]

Originally Posted by JFP in PA

Nope, it is a noise baffle. If you really stop a moment and look at the opening in the body with the grill removed and the “snorkel” still in place, a whole lot of stuff can get passed it, so as a debris preventative, it would be pretty poor; you’d be a lot better off with some simple mesh for that purpose………….

No, I pretty much think your wrong on that. The cup on the bottom is to keep debri and water from getting sucked in. Now how effective it is, well thats another question. If you really look at it, its obvious the cup is there for a reason, to keep crap out.

If you guys want to keep going, I have also read the for any increase in air flow your ecm need time to adjust. Just like pedro says when you install his techno flow thing. All the dynos I have seen have been negligible gains and the only one that reset his ecm was the one who claimed 5 hp gain after 17dynos.

Now I feel like I am defending it, when that was not the purpose. Its like one of those highschool debates that you have to take a side you care nothing about. People have asked about de-snorking and I thought I would try it.

There isn't enough evidence wither way to support a conclusion. I don't race so the HP gain or loss of + or - 2 hp doesn't matter. I would be concerned about mpg loss, but it makes no sense, as common sense dictates that you will get more air flow. The only things I can think of that might go against that is if the snork some how lessened the amount of turbulence, like pedros claim of his thing, and if hot air was sucked in rather than cooler air. I would lean towards the latter.

[Boxtaboy]

Originally Posted by mptoledo

No, I pretty much think your wrong on that. The cup on the bottom is to keep debri and water from getting sucked in. Now how effective it is, well thats another question. If you really look at it, its obvious the cup is there for a reason, to keep crap out.

If you guys want to keep going, I have also read the for any increase in air flow your ecm need time to adjust. Just like pedro says when you install his techno flow thing. All the dynos I have seen have been negligible gains and the only one that reset his ecm was the one who claimed 5 hp gain after 17dynos.

Now I feel like I am defending it, when that was not the purpose. Its like one of those highschool debates that you have to take a side you care nothing about. People have asked about de-snorking and I thought I would try it.

There isn't enough evidence wither way to support a conclusion. I don't race so the HP gain or loss of + or - 2 hp doesn't matter. I would be concerned about mpg loss, but it makes no sense, as common sense dictates that you will get more air flow. The only things I can think of that might go against that is if the snork some how lessened the amount of turbulence, like pedros claim of his thing, and if hot air was sucked in rather than cooler air. I would lean towards the latter.

If you look at the cup and where it sits when the grille is put back in, you'll notice that the two lower slats of the grille are closed off, which means the air leans straight into the curved portion of the cup as it goes in when the snork is in place. In other words, the cup at the end of the snork facilitates air to get sucked into the snork tube. So I think the cup was put there at the end to do just that...help suck in air. I don't think that the function of the snork is really to keep debris or water from entering, because 1) if you poke your hand back there in the hole that is left after you pull out the snork, you will find that the tube path goes up and to the left in the airbox, and not straight to the air filter, and 2) there is a water drain further back in the airbox by the air filter area, so water still would not enter the engine. I think it's in there to faciliate a smooth passage of air from the outside to the intake, while keeping noise levels down.

[JFP in PA]

Originally Posted by mptoledo

No, I pretty much think your wrong on that. The cup on the bottom is to keep debri and water from getting sucked in. Now how effective it is, well thats another question. If you really look at it, its obvious the cup is there for a reason, to keep crap out.

Look at what you are dealing with: Because of where the opening is located on the side of the car (well below the belt line), and because most of the air flow is thru the upper slats in the grill, any debris or water that entered would drop down and be collected in what you describe as a “cup”, directly in front of the opening to the intake system………..hardly seems as a good description for something to prevent the debris from getting into the intake; and if fact looks more like something to help it get sucked in………

It is a noise abatement device, nothing more…………….