Carfax not helping - 986 Forum - The Community for Porsche Boxster & Cayman Owners

Marksman · 10-13-2021, 02:32 PM

I listed a nice 2001 S on a popular auction site a few days ago. In the process, I saw that CARFAX reported a minor accident for my car. I was very surprised, because I was not aware that the car had been in an accident (at least not in the way I understand the term “accident”).
According to the prior owner, my Boxster was the second car behind a collision that occurred ahead. Debris flew up in the air and hit the top of the trunk. A small dent, about half the size of a dime was the result. I pointed that out in the photos of the ad.
The CARFAX report listed the damage as “Minor.” The CARFAX explanation of minor damage is: Minor damage is usually cosmetic, including dents or scratches to the vehicle body. On a 20-year-old car, why is CARFAX compelled to report this?
The problem is the heading reads, “Minor Accident.” For many, that is an automatic disqualifier. This unnecessary report reduces the value of vehicles and causes financial loss to the sellers.
Let me know what you think.

moosport · 10-13-2021, 02:46 PM

if insurance is involved, it will be on carfax. Unless you have the pictures of the damage, hope for the best.

Marksman · 10-13-2021, 03:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by moosport

if insurance is involved, it will be on carfax. Unless you have the pictures of the damage, hope for the best.

I have taken the pictures of the half dime size dent and included it in my sales description.
My problem is the fact that CARFAX reported a Minor Accident, which hurts the value of my vehicle. I don't see that being justified for such a minor dent...half a dime size!!!

Starter986 · 10-13-2021, 04:07 PM

Tell anyone who tries to nickel and dime you (no pun intended) over that Carfax report tell them to pis... er... take off. If they're relying on a half-ass reporting platform they're in for a world of hurt. $$$$

Many accidents never have been reported. Not everyone reports.

If they don't buy your accident explanation... move on. Good luck.

Marksman · 10-13-2021, 04:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Starter986

Tell anyone who tries to nickel and dime you (no pun intended) over that Carfax report tell them to pis... er... take off. If they're relying on a half-ass reporting platform they're in for a world of hurt. $$$$

Many accidents never have been reported. Not everyone reports.

If they don't buy your accident explanation... move on. Good luck.

I will move on, but I think CARFAX is causing losses to sellers by reporting things that are not relevant. Any attorneys listening? How many sellers have been hurt by this nonsense?

old911doc · 10-13-2021, 05:03 PM

Those buyers who consider such a report an ‘automatic disqualifier’ are for the great part individuals who are not knowledgeable enough or energetic enough to make their own independent evaluation of a used car. Consider yourself lucky that you won’t have to deal with them. In my experience the more savvy the buyer the easier they are to deal with, fewer stupid questions, fewer excessive expectations.
For buyers who are unable to assess independently the condition and value of a used car there is a ready alternative : a dealership.

Stl-986 · 10-13-2021, 05:23 PM

Nothing you can do about it. Carfax pays to get the info from the insurance companies. They aren't doing any business with you so again, nothing you can do about it.

To be honest, anytime I sell a car and the 1st communication from someone is asking for a carfax report I just ignore them. They obviously dont understand how those work, or even how inaccurate they are. Sometimes it could be 2 years before they even show something...or longer.

Newsguy · 10-14-2021, 06:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stl-986

To be honest, anytime I sell a car and the 1st communication from someone is asking for a carfax report I just ignore them. They obviously dont understand how those work, or even how inaccurate they are. Sometimes it could be 2 years before they even show something...or longer.

Exactly! I sell cars for a friend part-time, and we just had one car with Carfax admitting right on the statement in front of the description that they were just adding an incident from SEVEN years ago!

Marksman · 10-14-2021, 06:12 PM

I am disappointed with the CARFAX report, because they unnecessarily cheapen the car by associating it with an "Accident". The dent is not more than a half dime, the car was not involved in the collision, it just got hit with some debris.

Any rock kicked up from a vehicle could have done the same damage. If a rock damages your windshield and you need a replacment, wouldn't the same CARFAX logic apply and prompt a report of an accident?

Fact is, an accident reported on CARFX causes financial loss to any seller that advertises his car for sale (*** Any Attorneys reading this***). There needs to be some oversight to hold CARFAX accountable for reducing the value of peoples cars. Just my 2 cents worth.

Stl-986 · 10-14-2021, 10:59 PM

Dont see how they cheapen the car. If an insurance company was involved and there was any kind of payout then they are just reporting facts as they are provided them.

As far as windshield replacement by an insurance company...no, this isn't something that is included in the data that is sold to carfax...IF the insured is the one that makes the claim and it is part of the coverage.

While anyone can dislike a fact, it doesn't make it any less a fact. Fact is the car was in some kind of accident and since it occurred outside of your ownership then there is nothing to be done. The only facts are that there was an accident, the vin of the car was involved and you were not the owner when it happened. The car could have been in an accident that the previous owner did not disclose to you (which isn't against the law in any state unlike a house).

A carfax report is no different then KBB value in how they are used when buying...or selling a car. Carfax is also not the only company that creates these so called "Vehicle history reports" There are thousands of cars that are totaled out by insurance companies that are never even reported to the national databases.

Bottom line...legally....Carfax isn't causing anyone financial loss, they just take data provided by them and put it into a pretty little report.

Again, you can not like a fact but that doesn't make it any less true.

husker boxster · 10-15-2021, 05:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stl-986

While anyone can dislike a fact, it doesn't make it any less a fact.

Totally agree.

So it appears you didn't run a CarFax on the car when you bought it? I assume the accident would have appeared back then. If you didn't get a CF, you didn't do your due diligence and now it's costing you. That's not CF's fault. I think this is fairly new, but at least CF has categorized it as minor.

In my Wheeler Dealer activities, I pass on cars that have accident damage reported on CF because I know my customer base isn't interested in cars with damage and I don't need the extra stories that have to be explained. But I deal in higher priced / newer cars than a 20 yr old car. Cars of your vintage have a higher chance of being in an accident just because they've had potentially more exposure. Customers of your car shouldn't be as affected by a minor accident. But everything else being equal, you'll probably have to price your car lower than one w/o accident damage.

Starter986 · 10-15-2021, 05:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stl-986

Bottom line...legally....Carfax isn't causing anyone financial loss, they just take data provided by them and put it into a pretty little report.

Again, you can not like a fact but that doesn't make it any less true.

Sorry. Bull****************.

Are you an attorney? Have you considered every single possible cause of action associated with a not entirely factual Carfux report? Have you interviwed every single seller? Did all of them tell you they suffered none... zero... no financial harM? Do you know the legal definition of "accident"? OK, then.

Not trying to be an ****************************, just wondering. Especially when someone makes such blanket statements.

Those facts... are they red or blue?

Yes. I remain a little testy this early in the morning.

Stl-986 · 10-15-2021, 06:22 AM

Actually, yes I am.

You have not been harmed. You perceive you have cause people may not be interested in the car with the facts that they are able to gather independent of you, but you have not been harmed. Until you sell your vehicle there is no harm and even then when you do sell it IF it doesn't sell for as much money as you want to get for it, still does not mean you have been harmed. Again...just facts.

Marksman · 10-15-2021, 07:38 AM

When it comes to automobiles, I think we all have a pretty good understanding of what an "Accident" is. Get a dime out, reduce it to half and tell if that damage rises to the level of an accident.

I let everyone make their own decision on that.

Is my car worth less with an "Accident" reported on CARFAX than than the same car with a clean report?

I let everyone make their own decision on that.

Just wanted to share my experience, thanks for all the input.

Starter986 · 10-17-2021, 06:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stl-986

Actually, yes I am.

You have not been harmed. You perceive you have cause people may not be interested in the car with the facts that they are able to gather independent of you, but you have not been harmed. Until you sell your vehicle there is no harm and even then when you do sell it IF it doesn't sell for as much money as you want to get for it, still does not mean you have been harmed. Again...just facts.

I never sat for the bar. Pursued law in the mid-80's when, in Cali, you could go into law school right out of high school. No 4 year degree required. Should have stuck with the plan.

I'll listen to an attorney before I'll listen to most doctors. Nicely played, Sir.

Stl-986 · 10-17-2021, 02:04 PM

I do feel your pain, dont get me wrong. As a buyer, I put 0 faith in any car history report. I just automatically assume there will be things wrong with any car I buy.

As a seller, I dont even bother responding to anyone who asks for one without looking at the car first. I wont provide the vin to anyone unless they are in person (only exception I have is if I sell a car to someone on here) If you are getting push back from people, I would remove the vin and tell them they can come see it in person. That will also get rid of the tire kickers too.