use of engine cleaner BG Engine Purge

[duncan11]

Hi , Has any one had any experience using engine cleaner. Spoke to my local indy yesterday and he does a oil service using BG Engine Purge , which is an additive put in the oil prior to draining, Then uses Mobil 1 oil . He says it is very succesfull in stopping any engine noises, by it cleaning the oil ways, etc. Looking on BG website , the Engine Purge is quite aggressive, and only kept in the engine whilst doing the oil service, He said its put in engine and run at 2000rpm for 30 mins, then drained, and new oil and filter fit. cheers alan

[JFP in PA]

If you used a good quality full synthetic oil, nonsense like this is not necessary. These additives can damage seals and other plastic components such as the vanes in the VarioCam system.

Basically, he is adding on services you don't need to run your bill up.

[lkchris]

Your mechanic has a nice catalog from BG with gifts he can order for accumulating "point" selling BG products.

[Racer Boy]

Originally Posted by JFP in PA

If you used a good quality full synthetic oil, nonsense like this is not necessary. These additives can damage seals and other plastic components such as the vanes in the VarioCam system.

Basically, he is adding on services you don't need to run your bill up.

Well put! It is just a way for the mechanic to make more profit.

[Gelbster]

The M96 seems to have some obscure lubrication issues.
The generally accepted recommendation by the M96 experts(NOT our guy!) is to use JGDT40 (or similar) and fit a full flow filter upgrade from LN + good quality magnetic drain plug.
We use BG in the shop for some very limited applications as a last ditch , customer-will-not-pay-more attempt to clear excessive carbon build-up from intake systems.That is a different issue to yours?Different product to the "Engine Clean" you mention. Eventually the carbon has to be removed mechanically so the BG is just a band aid.

[jakeru]

My fairly new (to me) 2001 base with >100k on the clock recently got its first oil change. At only 7500 miles, which was half of the manufacturer recommended change interval, I was expecting it to look more clean than it did. But more alarmingly, I was quite surprised to find the newly changed oil, after simply idling the motor for a few minutes (to charge the oil filter), then letting it simply sit for several hours (to allow the oil level to stabilize, after which I drained about a pint to optimize the oil fill level) looks significantly darker than when it went in. That tells me there is residue in the motor.

I considered using a "flush" product, but I think the risk of unknown and potentially damaging chemicals lurking where you don't want them (e.g., in the lifters) is too great. I'll instead lower my oil change interval on the next change, and monitor the appearance of how carbon-loaded the drained oil appears. I might repeat that more than once if needed, New oil (some more than others - do you research to avoid this turning into an "oil holy war" thread) has detergent properties that should help clean residue from the motor, without needing to use any "additives" or "flush" products.

[JFP in PA]

Originally Posted by jakeru

My fairly new (to me) 2001 base with >100k on the clock recently got its first oil change. At only 7500 miles, which was half of the manufacturer recommended change interval, I was expecting it to look more clean than it did. But more alarmingly, I was quite surprised to find the newly changed oil, after simply idling the motor for a few minutes (to charge the oil filter), then letting it simply sit for several hours (to allow the oil level to stabilize, after which I drained about a pint to optimize the oil fill level) looks significantly darker than when it went in. That tells me there is residue in the motor.

I considered using a "flush" product, but I think the risk of unknown and potentially damaging chemicals lurking where you don't want them (e.g., in the lifters) is too great. I'll instead lower my oil change interval on the next change, and monitor the appearance of how carbon-loaded the drained oil appears. I might repeat that more than once if needed, New oil (some more than others - do you research to avoid this turning into an "oil holy war" thread) has detergent properties that should help clean residue from the motor, without needing to use any "additives" or "flush" products.

If you suspect build up, long before I would dump any aftermarket product into the engine, I would switch temporarily to a diesel oil such as the Shell Rotella T6, which is a 5W-40 0il that is both very high in detergency (required in a diesel) and in ZDDP (diesels do not have cats, so they can run high ZDDP).

When you change the oil after 3-5K miles, it will be ugly, but that is what you want.

[Gilles]

Originally Posted by JFP in PA

If you suspect build up, long before I would dump any aftermarket product into the engine, I would switch temporarily to a diesel oil such as the Shell Rotella T6, which is a 5W-40 0il that is both very high in detergency (required in a diesel) and in ZDDP (diesels do not have cats, so they can run high ZDDP).

When you change the oil after 3-5K miles, it will be ugly, but that is what you want.

JFP, a couple of years ago I bought a very low miles (but used) Volvo V70 non turbo for my wife to replace an identical one that was totaled by our youngest son (I am sure someone here can relate to this as well… ha)

The car was in pristine condition but the engine has some sludge build up that you can see when you put the oil on the engine and was considering flushing it, now the engine has about 80k and your idea of the Shell Rotella T6 sounds pretty good.

Question: Do you think that the high ZDDP content be fairly safe for the cat if used for 3-5k miles?

Thank you in advance for your comments!

[JFP in PA]

High levels of ZDDP is fine for many, many miles. We have cars that have been running high ZDDP oils for over 160K and the cats are just fine. In fact, we only use high ZDDP oils in the shop. The entire concept of ZDDP killing the cats is way, way over stated.

[Gilles]

Thanks JFP.
When we got this V70 a couple of years ago it was burning some oil despite of the low mileage, and after two years (and 4 oil changes) with good quality synthetic Castrol the oil consumption have reduced drastically (perhaps had a sticky ring or something else), but still want to remove the sludge inside the engine, thanks again!
Regards,
Gilles

[jakeru]

Thanks for the suggestion, JFP - I will take a look at running a synthetic 5W40 diesel oil for my next "engine cleaning" fill. From my experience with diesel engines, I recall their oil sure becomes dark (routinely completely black)!

By the way, pictured is what the 7500 mile old oil looked like (shown on a paper towel alongside new, uninstalled oil for comparison).

[Flavor 987S]

Originally Posted by jakeru

My fairly new (to me) 2001 base with >100k on the clock recently got its first oil change. At only 7500 miles, which was half of the manufacturer recommended change interval,

The Porsche oil change interval was updated years ago. IIRC, it's now 10,000 miles. Not the old 15,000 miles. So, 1/2 the interval should now be 5,000 miles, which is the oil change interval I use.


And I've run high zinc & phosphorus olis (Mobil V-Twin 20W50) in my old 993 Turbo for many-many miles......over 40,000 miles with zero issues to the cats. Most "high" ZDDP oils today are still BELOW the ZDDP levels of oils from years ago before our gubbermint got involved. Bottom line, cats are cheap compared to engines. Most of the high quality Porsche engine builders have a boneyard full of good, fully functional cats laying around.......they far outnumber the dead motors.

[Gilles]

Originally Posted by JFP in PA

If you suspect build up, long before I would dump any aftermarket product into the engine, I would switch temporarily to a diesel oil such as the Shell Rotella T6, which is a 5W-40 0il that is both very high in detergency (required in a diesel) and in ZDDP (diesels do not have cats, so they can run high ZDDP).

When you change the oil after 3-5K miles, it will be ugly, but that is what you want.

JFP,

Sometimes, I get a noisy lifter when the engine is warming up, do you think that switching (temporarily) to the Shell Rotella T6 somehow could help to clean the lifters?

My engine has a bit over 100k and other than the occasional lifter noise, it runs pretty smooth (Been changing the oil @ +/- 5k miles since new)

As always, thank you for our comments.

.

[dghii]

OP, might want to have a read as this was recently posted in another thread. Specifically warns against flush products in M96 engines....

https://lnengineering.com/news/tech-tuesday-buying-porsche/

[Pdwight]

But I change mine twice a year anyway.....oil is cheap compared to labor and parts