Stupidest engine question...EVER

[Laminarman]

Were the M97 engines ever used in the Boxster? I'm getting a 2006 S and see it has an M96 engine code. I guess I got confused and assumed an M96 meant "986" and M97 meant "987" type. At least someone told me that a while back but now I'm all confused.

[Timco]

Not a stupid question at all.

I can't answer it.....

[BIGJake111]

To my knowledge m96 is all base 911s and base and S Cayman and boxster until they got DFI and the 9A1 engine.

The only car with the m97 to my knowledge is the carrera S from like 05 to 08 or whatever

[kjc2050]

Porsche 997 M96 vs M97 Engine Differences - Rennlist

[jdraupp]

It was my understanding the m97 had the oversized bearing. But maybe not.

[BIGJake111]

I think all cars after 05 are oversized bearing m96 and m97

[imon_2nd]

Hello, Laminarman.

That's a difficult question, certainly not a stupid one. I'm trying to get an answer out of Porsche North America because the engine in my 2004 Boxster S was replaced under warranty before I got it. The Porsche dealer who did the work has purged their records from before 2010, so they can't help. After I bought the car a few weeks ago and went to get the IMS bearing replaced, among other things, the shop told me they couldn't do the job without splitting the cases. That indicates the motor is post-2005. But, maybe not.

At least two factors are involved here: Porsche made running changes during production of the M96 motor that included various IMS bearing versions, and then introduced the M97, which has a "captured" IMS bearing. Early M97s may also contain a weak version of the bearing. Documents in the successful class action lawsuit against Porsche based on IMS bearing failures contain some clues, but do not reveal everything Porsche knows for obvious reasons.

I'm determined to get to the bottom of this business and will start a new thread when I have the facts.

Cheers,

Dave

[Laminarman]

Originally Posted by imon_2nd

Hello, Laminarman.

That's a difficult question, certainly not a stupid one. I'm trying to get an answer out of Porsche North America because the engine in my 2004 Boxster S was replaced under warranty before I got it. The Porsche dealer who did the work has purged their records from before 2010, so they can't help. After I bought the car a few weeks ago and went to get the IMS bearing replaced, among other things, the shop told me they couldn't do the job without splitting the cases. That indicates the motor is post-2005. But, maybe not.

At least two factors are involved here: Porsche made running changes during production of the M96 motor that included various IMS bearing versions, and then introduced the M97, which has a "captured" IMS bearing. Early M97s may also contain a weak version of the bearing. Documents in the successful class action lawsuit against Porsche based on IMS bearing failures contain some clues, but do not reveal everything Porsche knows for obvious reasons.

I'm determined to get to the bottom of this business and will start a new thread when I have the facts.

Cheers,

Dave

Thank you Dave. I had a PPI done and the dealer who did it said at 49,000 miles and the way it's been maintained it should not be a problem with the IMS. The date of engine build was July 2005 for model year 2006. Is it easy to just look under there and see if it's the replaceable bearing or do you need to take stuff off. Getting the car this weekend.

[JFP in PA]

Originally Posted by Laminarman

Thank you Dave. I had a PPI done and the dealer who did it said at 49,000 miles and the way it's been maintained it should not be a problem with the IMS. The date of engine build was July 2005 for model year 2006. Is it easy to just look under there and see if it's the replaceable bearing or do you need to take stuff off. Getting the car this weekend.

If the replacement engine was built in 2005, it could go either way. The only way to know which bearing is in this engine is to pull the trans and flywheel and look at the center bolt; if it is a 22 MM, it is the non serviceable IMS bearing which cannot be replaced without pulling the engine apart. Because 2005 was a transitional year, even Porsche could not tell you more without looking.

[Laminarman]

Originally Posted by JFP in PA

If the replacement engine was built in 2005, it could go either way. The only way to know which bearing is in this engine is to pull the trans and flywheel and look at the center bolt; if it is a 22 MM, it is the non serviceable IMS bearing which cannot be replaced without pulling the engine apart. Because 2005 was a transitional year, even Porsche could not tell you more without looking.

This is what I thought, which sounds like the stupidest most backwards asinine thing in the world. Still love the cars though. I miss my 911SC and 944S2 and need to be back in one.

[husker boxster]

Originally Posted by Laminarman

I had a PPI done and the dealer who did it said at 49,000 miles and the way it's been maintained it should not be a problem with the IMS.

That is strictly a guess on his part. There is no way to know w/o removing the trans to inspect it before giving a clean bill of health. Now if the previous owner did lots of oil changes and drove it 5K+ mi a yr, then there's a chance you won't have any problems. But it's a crapshoot and I wouldn't put too much stock in a guess.

Late in the M96 run, Porsche put the captive (larger IMS) in. So no way to know which IMS you might have. There's a chance with your car being a 2006, it might be late in the run and have the larger IMS. If you have an M97 engine, you'd know for sure it was the larger one.

Drive it for a while (a yr maybe?), save up some money and have the clutch replaced. Then you can see which version you have. If it's the smaller IMS, replace it.

[Laminarman]

Originally Posted by husker boxster

That is strictly a guess on his part. There is no way to know w/o removing the trans to inspect it before giving a clean bill of health. Now if the previous owner did lots of oil changes and drove it 5K+ mi a yr, then there's a chance you won't have any problems. But it's a crapshoot and I wouldn't put too much stock in a guess.

Late in the M96 run, Porsche put the captive (larger IMS) in. So no way to know which IMS you might have. There's a chance with your car being a 2006, it might be late in the run and have the larger IMS. If you have an M97 engine, you'd know for sure it was the larger one.

Drive it for a while (a yr maybe?), save up some money and have the clutch replaced. Then you can see which version you have. If it's the smaller IMS, replace it.

And if it's the larger??? Just leave it?

[husker boxster]

Yes. They are supposedly more reliable (break at a 1% rate vs 10% - allegedly).

[BoxsterSteve]

Originally Posted by Laminarman

And if it's the larger??? Just leave it?

You don't have much of a choice.
The engine must be removed and stripped and the case must be split to replace the large bearing.

[jdlmodelt]

could a guy insert an inspection snake camera inside the bell housing behind the flywheel and get a view? Maybe with the starter removed?

Originally Posted by JFP in PA

If the replacement engine was built in 2005, it could go either way. The only way to know which bearing is in this engine is to pull the trans and flywheel and look at the center bolt; if it is a 22 MM, it is the non serviceable IMS bearing which cannot be replaced without pulling the engine apart. Because 2005 was a transitional year, even Porsche could not tell you more without looking.