Stick-shifters Unite ...
 

... you have nothing to lose but your clutch!

Below, from Porsche info accompanying the display of the new Turbo at the Geneva auto show. Dateline is Geneva, 2/28/06.

"The 2007 Porsche 911 Turbo, which makes its public debut today at the Geneva Motor Show, combines the latest evolution of variable-geometry turbochargers and automatic transmissions to produce stunning standing-start acceleration figures. Equipped with the newly updated and optional 5-speed Tiptronic S automatic transmission, the all-wheel-drive 911 Turbo will accelerate from a standing start to 60 mph in only 3.4 seconds. This is 0.3 seconds quicker than a 911 Turbo equipped with the standard 6-speed manual transmission."

I meet the future without fear.
I've always driven manual, but the technology is rapidly getting to the point where consumer automatics will be equal/better than manuals. F1 got there some time ago. The new VW GTI is supposed to have a really good unit from Audi, waiting on the local dealer to get one in so I can try it. When the autos are smooth, rev-matching and affordable, why not "shift"?
Pun intended...

Anybody still shooting film cameras? Technology advance is relentless.

Give me a good old fashioned "3 on-the-tree" any day!!!!

Show me an automatic that is quicker and equally fun to drive... only then will I switch.

Hi,

It's always incredble to see the diminishing effect Testosterone has on the Reasoning Ability of the Male Brain.

Set aside, for a minute, the fact that you have to be Jenson Button (on his Best Day) to actually get to 60MPH in 3.7 sec. with a Manual 6-Speed. But say that you actually do, then you'll be exactly 0.53 Car Lengths (7'6") ahead of the Tiptronic Car. Depending upon the Gearing of each Transmission, the Tip S may actually be the faster Car overall.

I find it ironic that there is so much resistance to the new Auto Boxes out there while Porsche added Drive-by-Wire without so much as a Whimper from the Faithfull... so much for the arguments about Direct Driver Input.

The Auto Boxes are getting Better and Faster. And, you do not have to be Jenson Button to do it in 3.4 sec. - EVERY Time! They cost less over time to maintain and allow the Driver to better concentrate on Braking and maintaining one's Line. So, c'mon, Move from the Darkness into the Light... Technology Marches On!...

Happy Motoring!... Jim'99

I'll always have a stick shift in my Porsche. None of my friends nor my wife knows how to drive a stick and thus, they don't ask me to drive my car, which is just fine with me.

That's my reason and I'm sticking with it, right or wrong.

I agree with Jim 100%. Now, if Porsche would just adopt and adapt the DSG (dual clutch manual) gearbox that Audi and VW are using then I would be the first one in line. I thought they were going to do that with the '07 turbo but I guess not.

I find the present Tiptronic pretty unsatisfying to drive. Of course, I have not driven the new one so I would be open to that being much better.

Overall, I like the Box with a manual even if the auto turns out to be quicker. The involvement is fun to me.

On other cars, the auto is actually preferable, as the stick unit itself is no fun at all.

To each his own.

The automanuals are simply not as much fun...

Now if you're asking me which transmission I'd rather have in a race car then the semiautomatics win hands down. They shift quicker, don't blow shifts, are more consistent, and easier to drive.

Interesting read on this subject, the Audi DSG specifically.

http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/content/11409729731880944331/index.php

Good article. It's nice to know that Jim and I are not just lone voices, crying in a wilderness of stick shift bigots.
I enjoy driving my '64 MGB with it's 4-speed manual (NON-SYNCHRO 1st gear, even!), and firmly believe it would not be improved with an automatic.
Technology marches on, however, and the modern automobile with it's computer-controlled-everything will eventually swallow the manual transmission without leaving so much as a hiccup.
The author of the article was incorrect in one thing however. F1 cars do have a reverse gear, required by regulation.

who cares about 0-60?
Let's see which is quicker around the N-Ring.

btw, paddles/tips are inventions of satan :mad: that have ruined motorsports. Drivers can now wait until the very last possible second to shift and avoid a trailing driver from challenging his position.
Ditto for carbon braking, drivers can brake much much later leaving less space for a passing move. Those two "advancements" have watered down the talent pool at every level of motorsports. Today's drivers wouldn't las a lap eras gone by and the average age is dropping with the excitement level.

learning to properly brake, shift and steer is an art form in danger of becoming extinct! Merc now makes their stupid cars with cruise control that will auto brake and throttle for you :barf:

Same here. Tiptronic doesn't do it for me--I like automatics, but not for a sports car. I like being fully engaged in the driving experience and none of the automatics-with-manual-buttons have done it for me so far.

My preference for sticks has nothing to do with how fast I can get from zero to sixty. It's all about smooth transitions and being in the proper gear at the proper time. No automatic has shown that it can do that.

I'm waiting for affordable DSGs myself. :cheers:

I must start out by saying:

"I love the BMW SMG tranny in the M3."

You feel the car actually shift gears. The BIGGEST pet peave of the auto-manuals is if your in a gear at 3000RPM and you depress the gas pedal to the floor, it will automatically downshift to kick the RPM's up. In the BMW M3 is does NOT do this because it relies on the driver to shift MANUALLY!

I've test drove the Audi/VW auto DSG and it sucks. It will downshift if you floor it. You might as well have the standard slushbox. Should they (REVO/Neuspeed) come out with a "Track" shift program that will hold the gear and NOT downshift, I'd be in...maybe.

KRZ

Stick shift is the way to go... There is nothing like banging through the gears on an on ramp to the freeway... Can't get that feeling from any auto..and I love to be in control of all aspect of my driving. No trans no computer ME only.....LOL


:cheers:

Even my mom drives a stick shift boxer and she's 60!

I watched a highway race between two M3's on racingflix...one had SMG the other stick. Everytime they shifted the SMG pulled ahead slightly and the stick driver is a friend of mine who knows how to shift a stick. Even so, I like manuals better for the driver involvment that you can't get with an auto.

It used to be that the argument for the manual transmission was performance-oriented, i.e., better acceleration, less power loss, no inappropriate upshifting in corners, etc.
With the advent of newer automatics these criticisms have largely been negated, to the point where in at least some applications performance is superior.
The pro-manual argument has now been reduced to touchy-feely. More driver involvement, a real sports car should have a manual transmission, my mother drives a stick.
The manual transmission will be a relic and an artifact in my lifetime, and I got my Medicare card last week.

Funny that 90% of the world uses manuals while 90% of America uses automatics. I remember walking down the streets in Rome and maybe 1 out of every 20 parked cars was an automatic. I wonder if it's because of fuel economy, repairs, control, or what.

Hey Ron, what's a record player????

Funny that 90% of the world uses manuals while 90% of America uses automatics. I remember walking down the streets in Rome and maybe 1 out of every 20 parked cars was an automatic. I wonder if it's because of fuel economy, repairs, control, or what.

- Porschekid

I think its because Americans are generally lazy and shiftless...get it? He said "shiftless".

I'll be here all week, folks...

When I was walking around in Rome a few years ago, 90% of the moving vehicles I saw were mopeds and scooters. They drive like crazy!!

Hi,

Well clearly, it's a very polarized issue. It seems for many, you'll have to pry their Gearshift Knob from their Cold, Dead, Fingers as they go the way of the Dinosaur...

I mean, Automatics... they're not just for your Buicks anymore... at least so sayeth Porsche, Ferrari, Lamborghini, BMW, Mercedes Benz, Audi, Aston Martin...

Happy Motoring!... Jim'99

Y'know, I was thinking about this as I was driving around during lunch and I realized that, faster or not, performing a proper downshift is just more satisfying than punching a button or pulling a paddle. To know that you've properly blipped the throttle and are now in the right gear, ready to utilize the powerband, well it's kind of like the car's patting you on the back, y'know? Doing it under brakes and revving down through three gears as you come down off a freeway is like getting an A+ on your extra credit work. :)

I do really want a clutchless manual someday like DSG, but I'll miss the rewards you get from driving a stick.

As I understand it, all of those mopeds and scooters have automatic transmissions. That means those folks are lazy and shiftless also!

I like manuals. Have drove an auto or two. Had an M3 SMG which was quite slick. A few thoughts.

1. Few sports cars -- M3, Boxster, Z4 etc. are monsters from 0-60. That is not what they are designed for ... balanced driving in the twisties is the design goal. Using 0-60 as "the measuring stick between an auto and manual in a sports car is like saying the Yankees will win the series because they have a better bat-boy." Tough to heel-toe an auto though they have some advantages as well -- for example they allow more concentration on the road.
2. The 0-60 (and 1/4) time is largely determined by the launch. In a boxster, there is one shift after the launch before 60 MPH -- a straight pull. Tips are listed as 1.0 second slower than a manual because they are tougher to get a great launch. Repeated good launches in autos are easy. Manuals can get a good to great launch repeatedly with minimal work/practice. Installing better tires can improve launch dramatically. (OBTW SMG M3s have a special launch mode just for us Americans -- it "attempts" to replicate a perfect launch. We love to squeal our wheels. Still SMGs are slower than a manual from 0-60 and they can execute a pefect shift faster than any man every time.).
3. Automatics may be cheaper to repair over time than manuals (tough to verify/validate) although I expect this is make/model specific. Autos cost 2 to 3K more and get worse gas mileage which is a clutch change or two in almost any car. I have had several clutches last 150 to 200K in cars as diverse as an MG, TR-6, Jensen Healey, Volvo, and a SAAB turbo. Today many automatics are disposable -- to expensive to repair.
4. From an engineering standpoint autos have more drive train losses than manuals. But in order to maximize the advantages of a Manual you usually are driving pretty agressively -- not good for the life of the clutch.

Its all good. If I lived in D.C. I would have an auto. Here in Blacksburg, my wife's and my Boxster are both manual (she drives a manual better than most guys.) I am disappointed that about 1/4 to 1/3 of the drivers can drive a Manual and most are older. It is becoming a lost art to do it well. However ... I cannot imagine life without a convertible ... that is a real crime.
just my dime.
ATB,
Tom

"Hey Ron, what's a record player????"

Pete,
If you want to come over, I'll show you one. Along with an "LP" copy of the original soundtrack from "Grand Prix".

I remember showing my then 92 year-old Grandmother a music CD several years ago, and she was baffled. She also thought my wife's car had a hole in the roof, until I explained what a sunroof was!!

92 aint that old.
Paul Newman came in third place at Lime Rock(in the rain!) in a Grand Am race at the age of 80!

Home Computer Idea +50 Years Ago
 

About 50 years ago, they thought our "home computers" would look like this:

Hi,

What's the Steering Wheel for...???

Happy Motoring!... Jim'99

It's a photoshop from a fark.com contest.

2004 computer

This is one of those emotional arguments where there really isn't a right answer. I have no doubt that engineering advances will produce a car that shifts faster and outperforms even the most talented manual shifters. Some say that has happened already. And there are those who just will not, or cannot, be bothered with the "distraction" of shifting. And there are environments where shifting is just a pain in the butt, like stop and go rush hour commute.

But I disagree with Ronzi. Even if he were just getting his driver's license instead of his medicare card, the manual transmission will outlive him. There are two main reasons for this. First, manuals are still hundreds, if not thousands, of dollars cheaper than sticks. To many people it is the difference in owning a car or riding the bus (as we who are financially fortunate enough to own porsches may sometimes forget).

But, more importantly, to many it is an aesthetic and visceral choice. Unlike the transition from lp's to cd's, there are qualities in a manual that people desire. I agree with eslai in that there is a certain satisfaction in making your vehicle perform the way you want it to. It makes you feel more engaged to the car and more aware of the driving experience. And people will continue to pay to have that experience even if it no longer provides a performance advantage. And I say this as someone who drove an automatic my entire life until I bought my first porsche two years ago. Yes, I have an SUV with an automatic for those times when the practicality of the car is paramount. But I will forever also have a manual sportscar (hopefully a porsche) for those times when I want to have FUN driving.

98Boxster98, as far as I know it is not a photoshop. This is the photo that appeared in a 1954 Popular Mechanics Magazine.

No, he's right, man. Go check out the link he posted. I remember the photoshop contest where that image came from--it was hilarious!

Did I get PUNKED!

the other day my nephew came to my house and found one of my vinyl record, he is sixteen and had never seen one before, kids these days!! computers and Ipods.

As for the tiptronic, i always like it for the everyday drive, no fuss and easy to change gears in manual position, in fairness i probably never used it in auto only, the only draw back was when driving on the track in sharp bends, as the steering wheel would be at some stage on the wrong way to change gears (selectors on steering wheel) and the inability to change gear when wanted due to the safety gap in gear changing (impossible to gear down to 2nd from 3rd coming into a bend for exemple) when arriving too fast, and beleive me this was a pain as you would come out of the bend in the wrong gear and had to gear down to go again!
real painful

I'm starting to wonder why I have endless shelves full of CDs when I have them all in an iPod which is about the size of a pack of cigarettes. I'm happy to not have those things taking up space anymore...

Change is good, you just have to keep on top of it.

Next you'll be telling us about black and white TV :P

I'm waiting for a digital format that's both portable and audiophile-quality. MP3s really screw up the sound stage and highs no matter what compression setting I set them up with. The day all audio distribution happens on MP3 files instead of a plastic platter will be the day I roll up into a fetal position and rock myself gently into oblivion.

I recently read somewhere that your old "Hi-Fi" equipment could be worth a lot of money! I guess there's a huge market out there.