FRS DI issue - grass is not greener

[Jake Raby]

The 9a1 is not immune, for sure. Here is the inside of a 4,465 mile engine that I have my hands in now. These things were noted when we I disassembled the engine to take it from 3.4 to 4.2 liters for a 2012 Cayman R. It had no symptoms, or known issues and had never even had its first oil service. It did make lousy power on the dyno and upon teardown I found out why.

First is the worn cylinders (all of them looked like this)


Then come the broken piston rings


Then the worn lifters


Then the root of the issue, a missing O ring from the anti-aeration side of the main oil pump which leads to the de-aeration swirl pots


The oil was heavily aerated and lost film strength creating these issues. The car was bought new by the owner who sent it to me and was untouched from the factory. Only MY hands have been inside it. Missing parts from the factory? Yep and if this one had them, it can happen again.

As we get evolve the 9a1 engines we have also found valve guide wear and other issues. We already have 3 years of development under our belts with the 9a1 DFI engines and the deficiencies are becoming more clear with each one. Others won't see these issues for 5-6 more years, more than likely.

[KRAM36]

Originally Posted by Jake Raby

The 9a1 is not immune, for sure. Here is the inside of a 4,465 mile engine that I have my hands in now. These things were noted when we I disassembled the engine to take it from 3.4 to 4.2 liters for a 2012 Cayman R. It had no symptoms, or known issues and had never even had its first oil service. It did make lousy power on the dyno and upon teardown I found out why.

First is the worn cylinders (all of them looked like this)


Then come the broken piston rings


Then the worn lifters


Then the root of the issue, a missing O ring from the anti-aeration side of the main oil pump which leads to the de-aeration swirl pots


The oil was heavily aerated and lost film strength creating these issues. The car was bought new by the owner who sent it to me and was untouched from the factory. Only MY hands have been inside it. Missing parts from the factory? Yep and if this one had them, it can happen again.

As we get evolve the 9a1 engines we have also found valve guide wear and other issues. We already have 3 years of development under our belts with the 9a1 DFI engines and the deficiencies are becoming more clear with each one. Others won't see these issues for 5-6 more years, more than likely.

Every time I read one of Jake's post, I want to sell my car.

[kls]

Every time I read one of Jake's post, I want to sell my car.

I'm just glad he's not my MD.

[JFP in PA]

Originally Posted by Jake Raby

The 9a1 is not immune, for sure. Here is the inside of a 4,465 mile engine that I have my hands in now. These things were noted when we I disassembled the engine to take it from 3.4 to 4.2 liters for a 2012 Cayman R. It had no symptoms, or known issues and had never even had its first oil service. It did make lousy power on the dyno and upon teardown I found out why.

First is the worn cylinders (all of them looked like this)


Then come the broken piston rings


Then the worn lifters


Then the root of the issue, a missing O ring from the anti-aeration side of the main oil pump which leads to the de-aeration swirl pots


The oil was heavily aerated and lost film strength creating these issues. The car was bought new by the owner who sent it to me and was untouched from the factory. Only MY hands have been inside it. Missing parts from the factory? Yep and if this one had them, it can happen again.

As we get evolve the 9a1 engines we have also found valve guide wear and other issues. We already have 3 years of development under our belts with the 9a1 DFI engines and the deficiencies are becoming more clear with each one. Others won't see these issues for 5-6 more years, more than likely.

Jake, are you seeing the new "thermal management system" Porsche is using on these cars playing a role in premature wear?

[Jake Raby]

The thermal management system is only used on the latest of engines that we have not seen just yet. I have a 2014 GT3 on the way in this November for a big bore engine and we'll know more about it then as we attempt to stretch it out to 4.5 liters. Nothing wrong with it, in fact its not even being delivered to the customer until October and it'll have a couple thousand miles on it when I jump inside head over heels.

Note that the engine below with all the wear exhibited is so new that the QR code on the pistons is still very clear.

Solving problems is what we do as well as getting inside the latest engines before anyone else would even consider it. When I tore into the Cayman R engine I did not expect to find this wear and certainly did not expect to find missing internal parts that had lead to the wear. My jaw dropped when I found that missing O ring, but then the low power and wear I had seen all started to make sense immediately.

We learn things before we have to know them, and thats how we maintain a 5+ year edge on everyone else. Too many people believe that the 9a1 is the be all, end all solution for these cars only because it lacks an IMS. Many of those people will see the reason why Porsche employed the "layshaft" (IMS) in every flat 6 built prior to the 9a1. At least thats my long term hypothesis on the things that the future holds. The 9a1 is a better platform in most ways, but we have identified its weaknesses and have addressed them already.

We don't carry out "service" and we don't do anything thats "simple", if an engine finds its way here its already outside the scope of other shops, or its here to be made a lot bigger, a lot better and a lot faster, without compromise.

[southernstar]

Jake, if I am reading you correctly you are suggesting that the IMS is a good idea if properly executed - i.e., with proper bearings/bearing lubrication.

Brad

[Jake Raby]

Originally Posted by southernstar

Jake, if I am reading you correctly you are suggesting that the IMS is a good idea if properly executed - i.e., with proper bearings/bearing lubrication.

Brad

Nothing wrong with the design- everything wrong with the factory M96 bearing design.

I have an 88 Carrera with damn near 300K miles on the original engine and I am not alone. Until Porsche went to the ball bearing there have never been issues! The 547 4 Cam Carrera (Fuhrmann) engine utilized a layshaft in the mid 1950s and that also had no issues.

The difference? The Mezger and Fuhrmann engines are supported by PLAIN bearings with pressure fed oil delivery.

Omit the "IMS" and speed up the surface speeds of the drive chains and see what happens. Makes sense? No to me.

[Kenny Boxster]

I noticed the QR codes you mentioned earlier. Where do they go to if you scan them? I tried with the picture but not good enough resolution. For the curious in all of us.

[Jake Raby]

Originally Posted by Kenny Boxster

I noticed the QR codes you mentioned earlier. Where do they go to if you scan them? I tried with the picture but not good enough resolution. For the curious in all of us.

It says "not found", they are for the factory robots to deliver components to assembly stations. The entire engine is covered in them.