If you had $10,000 laying around...

[Muzzle of Bees]

Spend it on something fun. You will be lucky to make any money investing in the market. I took all of my investments and paid off my home a while back. Once you factor in management fees, stock or fund purchase costs etc. you may find you may have lost money. It is too much effort for too little benefit being in the market. I was buying stocks and mutual funds for years and wasted a lot of time doing it. However, you could get lucky and hit a home run with your investment.

[Perfectlap]

Originally Posted by Muzzle of Bees

You will be lucky to make any money investing in the market.... It is too much effort for too little benefit being in the market.

I think you will be unlucky to lose money investing in an index fund over the long term. It simply mirrors the health of the U.S. economy. Over the long run the U.S. economy will do better. How the average worker in that economy fares over the long run is another matter but big companies will keeep on keeping on.

As to your second point, It will be too much effort to sustain employment after age 65 if you fail to invest at all.

But I agree, the average investor has wasted a lot of time and money trying to pick and choose their way to positive long-term performance in the stock markets.
Assett diversification, over the long run is a better use of time and fees. However that diversfication needs to include at least some stake in the stock market, preferably as Mr. Buffett has demonstrated, in a fund that simply buys the whole U.S. stock market without any active management fees. A very simple investment that any worker, no matter how educated, can take advantage of. And is nearly impossible to beat over a 10 year period to boot. win win. Just make sure you don't have all your money in stocks, or all your money in your house, or all your money in some gold coins because Richard Petty buys gold too.

[Muzzle of Bees]

Originally Posted by Perfectlap

I think you will be unlucky to lose money investing in an index fund over the long term. It simply mirrors the health of the U.S. economy. Over the long run the U.S. economy will do better. How the average worker in that economy fares over the long run is another matter but big companies will keeep on keeping on.

As to your second point, It will be too much effort to sustain employment after age 65 if you fail to invest at all.

But I agree, the average investor has wasted a lot of time and money trying to pick and choose their way to positive long-term performance in the stock markets.
Assett diversification, over the long run is a better use of time and fees. However that diversfication needs to include at least some stake in the stock market, preferably as Mr. Buffett has demonstrated, in a fund that simply buys the whole U.S. stock market without any active management fees. A very simple investment that any worker, no matter how educated, can take advantage of. And is nearly impossible to beat over a 10 year period to boot. win win. Just make sure you don't have all your money in stocks, or all your money in your house, or all your money in some gold coins because Richard Petty buys gold too.

I did not say dont save or invest. You can still save money and ivest in items you feel will appreciate. I just dont think its wise to give money to investment firms or ask for their advise. I was in the market for about 13 years and when I did the math I barely made any money when I sold out. It is crap shoot not a guarentee.

[dbansal]

option 1: with the 10K, i would sell my box and get a nicer car
option 2: with the 10k, sell my box, and the additional cash I have put a down payment on a nice apartment or house...
option 3: pay off all of my student debt

[Perfectlap]

Originally Posted by Muzzle of Bees

I did not say dont save or invest. You can still save money and ivest in items you feel will appreciate. I just dont think its wise to give money to investment firms or ask for their advise. I was in the market for about 13 years and when I did the math I barely made any money when I sold out. It is crap shoot not a guarentee.

what year did you cash out?

[Muzzle of Bees]

"what year did you cash out? "

2010. I was tired of giving my money away. I was feeling like chum in the water with sharks. Now, if I had one million dollars or so that would be different. I would likely take the smaller margins, knowing that I can come and go in the market with having to be in for the long haul trying to make 10% or more. I dont like that much exposer in the market anymore. My company invests 6% or 7% of my gross salary each month though.

[Perfectlap]

^ Sounds like the Mark Cuban approach. He says 'buy and hold is for morons'.
He says he's all cash and only buys when the market has taken a severe beating. Then when everyone thinks its nothing but blue skies he sells and is back in all cash.

I would agree that the concept of "dollar cost averaging" is very suspect on a return basis, and coupled with a "long only" mentality (too many average investors never take money off the table after stellar years like 2013) it does set up a situation where its like sheep to the slaughter. But at the end of the day you ultimately have to believe that when share prices simply get too cheap, the deep pockets will almost assuredly always come in to scoop up fire sale prices. Except it's not just U.S. investors doing this now, it's a whole international pool of new investors as well. The same ones who are boosting real estate prices in big markets like NYC and Miami. It would have to be a really insane set of conditions, all happening at once to keep the investor away for good. Even a spectacular $20 trillion debacle, enough to buy and destroy China three times over, like in 2008 only saw a less than one year period before the reversal was firmly in place. Maybe the next collapse will take two years to recover from, but I sometimes wonder what it would have to take to keep them all way forever. I think aliens would have to come from another planet.

[BIGJake111]

put it with my boxster to trade for a clean 986 S