Is the Boxster the unloved stepchild?
 

The other evening I was far away from home in a hotel bar. A guy came in wearing an official Porsche Motorsports shirt.

I was returning from an SCCA racing weekend (not in a Porsche) where there had been a discussion about the fantastic support Porsche provides for people racing it's cars.

Not being shy (and having had a couple of drinks), I walked over to talk to the guy about the way they run their support organization. It turns out he is a fairly big fish in the Porsche Motorsport organization, on his way to a different venue. I told him I was a racer and that I had a Boxster as a road car and his immediate response (and I quote here) was "You have my deepest sympathy".

It didn't bother me really (then or now) but I was puzzled that a management type guy in a major car manufacturers motorsports organization would feel that that was an appropriate response. I sometimes think that Porsche builds the Boxsters as an evil necessity so they can get money enough from the suckers to build "real" sports cars.

Too bad, because the Boxster seems now to be recognized as the best two seater sports car on the planet. I wonder if 30 years down the road people will look back on the Box the same way that they look at some of the air cooled cars today? "Man those were real Porsches!"

Just some rambling thoughts.

Mr. "Big Fish" sounds like quite the *sshole. I'd write it off as just that, an asinine statement by a snob. Sounds like he belongs in a BMW :matchup:.

As an aside, I drive an air cooled 911, a guy down the street picked up a used 997 series 911 last year, apparently I'm unworthy of a return wave when we pass each other. Jerks come in all flavors, don't let them get you down. :cheers:

I've never seen it that way, but sometimes it seems that way, especially with how Porsche seems to "suffocate" the Boxster engines with the cats.
If anyone is treated as an unloved stepchild, It's the 944. I think it's okay though. If well maintained.

i don't get it . The automotive press always loved the Boxster since day 1 . it gets better with every revision . so many people knock it . It's a mid engined roadster !


Boxster voted best sports car fifth gear - YouTube

The Boxster IS the poor stepchild of Porsche because it always gets the short end of the stick. Where is the 3.4 or 3.6 model? Where is the Turbo model? Where is the GT-3 model? The Boxster is looked down on by people because Porsche looks down on it.

And as long as I'm ranting, Porsche started it all with the cutesy name: boxer engine + roadster = Boxster; Oh how clever! WTF? Right then and there the car was branded not to be taken seriously.

In Porsche-think, if you want a serious entry-level sports car, you buy a Cayman, a car with a rightful sports car name. Do you think for a minute that Porsche ever considered calling it the Coupster? Heck no!

There is EXTREME Carrera kool aide drinking within Porsche Motorsports. The engine will ALWAYS be in the rear. ZERO deviation from the script. unbelievers aka infidels, can knock themselves out with front and rear engine "commercial downgrades". Case in point: when Patrick Long was a tadpole at Porsche and not yet a fully ordained factory driver he was not allowed a Carrera for personal use. He could only ask for a Boxster.
Yes this logic is completely retarded····roadsters are roadsters·····GTs are GTs····sports coupes are sports coupes.
Only in the kool aide mind is one a substitute for the other. Secondly, it shows the brain washing of young drivers to revere the Carrera as the apex of Porsche.
Meanwhile in the long run as a sprint racer, the Carrera has zero chance of beating mid engine Ferrari. Ditto for the prototypes.
Endurance is all they have as far as racing and the mids steal that show right from under them every summer.

P.S.
The kool aide permeates down to the casual Porsche owner. Generally a tip off for a poser. I once started a poll in a track oriented forum asking if given the choice of engine placement in their next GT3 would they check the box for mid.
Fully 2/3's said yes to a mid engine GT3. I then posted a similar question in the "standard" Carrera variants forum and I was flamed right away and told to go away LoL. 2/3's of those guys responded that they would only buy a rear engine Carrera.
As you can see there is a disconnect between the rabid Porsche track enthusiasts and the mothership.

who cares what they think. I have 2 boxsters and a 996 C 4 and unless the weather warrants all wheel drive I generally always walk past the C 4 and drive a boxster. Way more fun to drive on a twisty road where horsepower is not nearly as important as balance. Most people who look down on the boxster really have no experience in them and just have a need to feel special.

My thinking exactly. It was just so strange to hear it so blatantly from a Porsche corporate guy. I wonder what my customers would think if I all but told them the equipment they bought from me was **************** and they were rubes for buying it?

FWIW, I'm old enough that I don't care what anyone thinks about the Box. It's the best two seat drop top sports car I can afford, and it may be the best one period. It's not my ego crutch, it's my daily smile machine.

After I was done telling that "blow-hard" how the boxster was design to emulate Porsche's first real two-seater mid-engine sports car, the 550 Spyder, as opposed to the Volkswagen Beetle-esque 356, I would have placed a "danger choke-hold" on his neck, followed by a judo chop !

it's funny how the "mid engined " Carrera GT is never mentioned buy these 911 fools .

Being fortunate enough to currently own both a Boxster (2006 987S) and an 911 (1997 993 Turbo) I consider myself pretty knowledgeable about this subject. I could go on for hours. But I won't. Been there, done that. Got the t-shirt.

Regarding what the "big fish" said, it should come as NO SURPRISE to us Boxster owners. But, it doesn't make it right, nor palatable. I also think it speaks volumes about that one person, than it does about any specific group.

Most people who say silly stuff about a Boxster, hasn't ever driven one, or hasn't established much seat-time in one. We (986 Forum members) have been saying for years, if Porsche built a Boxster with 911 power, there'd be a drastic drop in 911 sales. Actually, Porsche did build a Boxster with 911 power, it's called a Carrera GT. :) And a little out of my value proposition for a weekend toy.

With regard to the new 981 Boxster, in my 8 years as a Porsche enthusiast, I've NEVER seen more positive comments about a Porsche from the "911 contingent" as I have currently. This is great for Boxster owners and all involved.

Lastly, let's not lose sight that Porsche did move the new 991's engine slightly more center-mass. So, maybe my statement above is not so far fetched.;)

That 'look down your nose' attitude starts at an early age. In 2007 I was attending a Cubs game at Wrigley "Stadium" as Jeff Gordon calls it. I got there early and had my 01 Lapis Blue S parked in a spot just outside. A group of teenagers walked by and one said "ooh, look at the Porsche". One of the other guys says "that's not a real Porsche, it's a Boxster". I let them go on their way but thought about saying "so you wouldn't drive it if I threw you the keys". But I don't have the stones that JD has or his judo chop ability.

With my current inventory, I've got enough invested that I could afford a rather high buck 911. But I don't want one, they're not my cup of tea. Different strokes for different folks. Porsche should understand this and not consider us a necessary evil.

Us locals call it Chicago's largest bar.:)

You have my deepest sympathy that you have run into a Porsche snob. His opinion is just that - his opinion. Unfortunately there are many people like that but there are many decent human beings out there too. Move on. :):)

Did anybody read the current issue of Excellence on that carbon fibre "Boxster" prototype? It already churns out better lap times than other 911 race cars out there.

^ You last 2 guys (Sixtie and Ekam) both post at 9:11 AM. Traitors.:)

It is funny I was just lamenting the boxster second class view many have yesterday and both this thread and a shorter similar thread on 6speed were posted same time. It is funny all the 911 Porsche people I know well respect the boxster. A friend at work tho tends to look down on it not so much that it isn't a real Porsche but just that it isn't in the same class as a 911 especially higher end cars like a gt2/3 or turbo, etc... And not a classic like the older 911s. I sort of agree in that the higher end exotics, Ferrari, Lambo, and top of the line porsche is a different cost and category. He was sort of making fun of me for going on a local New Years drive where a bunch of people showed up in 911s, gt3, gt-R, a lambo etc...even tho there were other boxsters there and other older porches like a 914 944 etc...

The thing that gets me the most tho is perhaps power, as a previous poster mentioned, why not a super fast version, (although the new 981S changes that in my mind) and the styling. There is a large part of me that wishes the convertible top of the boxster looked better than it does when up. Since I am finding myself using the drop top less and less and I love the styling of the cayman that will likely be my next car. Even tho they are basically the same cars within reason. The cayman both in name and looks just does more for me, even tho it is still "in the shadow of the 911" for many people. Btw lets remember for name that Jeremey Clarkson did pen the cayman the "Coxster" lol.... ;)

I am not in the same time zone so I am exonerated. I posted earlier than 9:11. :dance:

I owned a 1997 993 cab and sold it and bought a 1997 993 turbo at the same time I had my 2001 986 Boxster S. All great cars. But when it came time to thin the car stable we kept the Boxster. Even while owning the 993s, I enjoyed the drive of the Boxster S more.

There were several others on the Rennlist 993 board that had Boxsters and spoke highly of them. Ones that have never drove one put them down. There will always be the purist that believe if it is not a 911, it is not a real Porsche. Then ones that think if its not air cooled it is not a real Porsche, then others that believe the 911 SC was the last real Porsche .... and so on.

Oh well, they don't know what they are missing.

This is a tread that will go on and on. We say we don't care but we reply, because we do care. For me and I think for many others, a used Boxster allows many entry into the P-Car experience at a some what reasonable price.
!!! I'm loving the experience - my grin making machine !!!

The 911 style is what many, including me, associate as traditional Porsche. Those of you with both in your stable have the inside view that can give the rest of us a more relevant comparison. We all know, along with the majority of the Driving press, that Porsche can't power up the Boxster because it will hurt 911 sales. That's the car Business. So it's one thing to have a 911 owner snub a Boxster owner, it's another, somewhat more painful for a company man to do it. I hope his boss and above don't have the same disregard

Funny you mention this. Porsche did extensive work on the 991 Cab's to improve this. They did an excellent write-up in a recent issue of the Christophorus. I think Porsche hit it out of the park with the 991's new top. It stunning.

Did they not do the same thing with the 981? Not sure. Maybe in the future??

I always find this statement a bit odd. If you can't afford a new 991 or newish 997 you can buy an old 911 all day long. The papers are full Carreras going for the same money as a low mileage Boxster or Cayman. In fact, some 996 Carreras can be had for barely $10K. High miles of course but a water-cooled Porsche can handle it.

The notion that a Boxster is the default option for a limited budget is misplaced.
Water-cooled Carreras are depreciating just the same as Caymans and Boxsters.
Actually when the stock market crashed in 2008-2009 they took a nighmarish beating. Some 996's that stickered well over $80K could be had for less than $40K before the factory warranty had even expired. Ouch.

When I was shopping I could have purchased my dad's 993 but instead went with the Boxster. I LOVE 993's and WILL own one variant or other of a GT3 some day.

However I do not ever plan on selling the Boxster. For me it has been the perfect balance of fun, practicality and modern comfort. Everyone will have their biases. However for someone like me, I would rather have purists pass on "less desirable models" so that I can get a better deal on an amazing car.

My ideal garage would have lots of Porsches and be a wide mix of all the models from the 356 to the Cayenne (gotta have a tow vehicle).

Perfect, you answered your own question. The usual purchasing advice for buying a used P-car is the newest model possible. That will be a Boxster, a comparably priced 911 will be older, and/or have much higher miles.

I think the Boxster looks better than a 911 Cab. , top up or down. Eh, each to their own :)

Well I know someone with a TPC twin turbo 430whp Cayman S(close enough), and it beats all the GT3's that come to the track. I was in the passenger seat when the driver was making sharp turns at 80mph passing those GT3's and Z06's. It was a blast.

Also, a hot women(seems to be 28 years old) waved to me a couple of times from her 997 Turbo S and we played around on our commute to work. My driving confidence allowed me to keep up with her. That made my day.

And yesterday I waved to a Boxster that also waved back.

Porsche number 1 was mid engined as I recall, as are their race cars.

Subsequent 356s were based on VW architecture for manufacturing econ. This why the engine is where it is. The 911 was a two plus two sports car compromise; so now you have wicked polar moment; this was optimized over the years. The layout has some unique handling characteristics that can be used to advantage and there is that quirky character brand appeal along with mastering it

The arrangement is not ideal though and didn't come from a performance justification. It was mass production economy for the general public along with 2 plus 2 seating. These days the arrangement is so far optimized and developed that there probably little justification other than seating capacity and unique handling.

I am a 911 variant fan; I grew up sitting atop a beetle engine but a "real" or traditional Porsche would have to be mid-engined.

Pics, please, or it did NOT happen. Thanks.

I recently did a very, very spirited drive on some very very twisty roads and I was 4th in line behind a new C 4S, a year old 997 turbo and a new GT3. I was in the 08 boxster S with the 3.4 and I had no problem staying right with them and they all seemed surprised and commented on it. On a straight pull any one of them had a tremendous advantage, but on a nice twisty road course they have very little advantage and certainly did not enjoy it any more in spite of their much higher purchase price.

and if LeMans didn't have a single peculiarly lonnnng straight it might not have been so ideal a race for the rear engine Carrera. Good thing the engines last.

haha. I will take a pic as soon as I see her again. I see her driving on my commute to work about once per week.

I'm not so sure that when it comes to Porsches, if that's the best advice.

Put it this way, if I had a sum of cash on hand for a sports car, enough to buy a regular type car new, but not enough to buy a new Porsche, I don't think finding the newest Porsche would be my objective.
I'd be looking at air-cooled along with the newer stuff. And depending on the 911 series (and the specific vehicle's history) I'd have no problem crossing off many water-cooled Porsches right off my list an opting for a much older Carrera vs. low mileage Boxster/Cayman.
The newer Porsches are said to be "low-maintenance" yet I've still put in over $13K in major maintenance and unexpected repairs with mileage well below 100K miles. Did I mention I only drive weekends? And unlike some air-coooled Porsches, my car is only bleeding value every year.

Well, I wanted a car to drive, not work on. Newer/low mileage is almost always a better bet. For an air-cooled 911 you'd be talking 15 or more years old. There's no getting around the fact that the higher the sticker price, the more it has to degrade/depreciate before hitting a certain price point.

Couple of things:
I think we need a definition of how "high up" this guy was in the hierarchy. I doubt anyone of any consequence would say something like that. And if this is like most racing schools, the majority of people working the event are temps, not regular employees. They get shipped around the country, from track to track, and then spend the rest of the year at home watching TV and drinking Buds. I have several friends in this business. Nice gig when you can get it, but it's a temp job of a couple of months a year.

Also, why is the Boxster ever compared to a Carrera? It's a roadster. That's what it is, a different animal in intent and style. It's a roadster in the tradition of the Carmen Ghia, the Triumph, the Alpine Sunbeam, the MG and all the other cool roadsters of history. I actually prefer it to the Carrera, and if you offered me a free 911 or a free Boxster, hands down, I'd take the Boxster. Better handling, cooler styling.

So Porsche makes cars other than the 911, so what? I believe other car makers have multiple models as well. :rolleyes:

I'm jumping in a bit late, but I thought I could add a bit to the discussion. I'm glad the Boxster is not loved nor respected as much as more expensive P Cars. For the same reason I'm glad not everyone agrees with my choice of the Sumitomo HTRZ III. Why? Because a used Boxster is affordable, and I can buy Sumitomo's for half what others are willing to pay for their tires. I'm cheap. But, I still want good products and often price is driven by popularity as much if not more than by the quality that went into the product. I teach marketing and I watch crappy products being sold for far more than they are worth to any thinking person.

I'm deliberately not posting the guys name, or anything I think could be used to identify him. On the off chance that someone from Porsche might view this thread, I have no desire to get the guy in trouble.

He was not at or on his way to a school. He was on his way to a major professional racing venue. He gave me his business card, which identified his capacity at Porsche which was not "temp". I looked him up on the interwebs and he is on an official Porsche website identified by job function.

If I wanted a Porsche....and I wanted a roadster with a drop top, what other choice would I have ?

Well, considering that the Boxster saved Porsche, and his job, he's a very (I'm being gentle here) ungrateful man.

In the 80's I was at the dealer to buy some parts & the guy in front of me looked at the counter guy in disgust & said "You mean I have to put a 914 part on my car?". He walked away looking like he had something in his mouth that he had stepped in but wouldn't eat.
When I stepped up to the counter I heard the guy behind the counter muttering "You have no idea how many 914 parts are on your car."
I stepped up, smiled & told the parts guy I need to order some parts for my 1970 914, he grinned from ear to ear.

LoL..... just like the Boxster is the 996 Carrera. Talk about a double whammy:
"Well the bad news is no more air cooled"
"And the good news? Well you know that Boxster you've be seeing on the road for the last three years? surprise! That's 2/3's of what will be all the new 911s. From the doors to the front license plate. Yep the whole interior will be lifted from the Boxster too."

There aren't many cars out there that can give the right amount of driver input/aura/smiles as the Boxster does. Period.

As for name, yeah, a Carrera 4GTS Cabriolet name does sound a little better and cost a little more.