Porsche 1 hour Crashed Unsure Why Can you help?

[ekam]

Originally Posted by Ghostrider 310

Once you lose a mid engine you never forget it, it spins in a unique way

Quite unique but you still hit the tree and die.

Top Gear Understeer and Oversteer explained - YouTube

[stephen wilson]

OK, maybe I shouldn't have said ALL conditions! Sub-40° with ANY moisture could spell serious trouble with Summer-only tires.

[Perfectlap]

so who is paying? and how much?

[san rensho]

Originally Posted by Frodo

On point as well. I've posted this before, but I'll post it again: The above warning goes TRIPLE if you're on summer performance tires and if it's both wet and cold. I've done it and had no time to recover---had my ass end in front in the blink of an eye. Was not even accelerating in a turn---was moving in a straight line, going up a gentle slope and punched it ever-so-slightly. That's all it took.

I won't say that I never drive with summer tires when it's cold, but I definitely take it easy. And if there's even a trace of dampness on the road, I drive like a Granny.

I learned my lesson last weekend. I was driving in the wet on the freeway, knowing that my rears were worn to the wear limit so I decided to check the rear traction. I made sure there was nobody close to me and I accelerated fairly hard in third gear, on concrete, in a straight line, around 50 mph. The rear immediately started to come around, pointing me to the right and headed right for a concrete wall. I countersteered full lock to the left, the car snapped back the other way and spun 360, so now I'm pointed in the right direction at least.

Put it in first gear and move off slowly. I look in the rearview and there are a few cars that are careful to keep their distance from me. Oopsie.

[Perfectlap]

Don't know if the OP has had driving instruction, but I spun my Boxster a few months after buying it and I had several seasons of autocross under my belt at the time. Luckily because i knew which way to turn the wheel when the back end gets jumpy I avoided a wreck with a parked car that was inches away. Yep...it was wet out.

When you transition from slow to faster while turning the wheel on wet ground...you better be used to quick flicks of the wheel and good with quick reactions. I was really stunned at how quickly the car did a full 180. The car is neutral but isn't loyal about it.

[Squozen]

I lost the rear end of a non-PSM '97 Boxster going quite slowly in a hairpin in Tasmania. It's certainly easy enough to do if the road is slick (which this one was) and if you apply the power a bit earlier than you should have (which I did). Fortunately I was going slowly enough to not slide into the retaining wall as it was a rental car and had a rather exciting insurance excess.

[Frodo]

Originally Posted by san rensho

I learned my lesson last weekend. I was driving in the wet on the freeway, knowing that my rears were worn to the wear limit so I decided to check the rear traction. I made sure there was nobody close to me and I accelerated fairly hard in third gear, on concrete, in a straight line, around 50 mph. The rear immediately started to come around, pointing me to the right and headed right for a concrete wall. I countersteered full lock to the left, the car snapped back the other way and spun 360, so now I'm pointed in the right direction at least.

Put it in first gear and move off slowly. I look in the rearview and there are a few cars that are careful to keep their distance from me. Oopsie.

Yeah, that sounds familiar. With my mishap, I had just left a stop light and, being at the front of the line of cars, headed out first, fortunately moving a bit quicker than the others at the light. Had put some useful distance between me and them when I managed to break the rear end loose---had the road to myself, basically. By the time the show was over (moments later) I'm sure they'd all slowed to a crawl, no doubt wondering what in hell it was I was doing. As I sat, nails digging into the steering wheel and me all goofy on adrenaline, they crawled past giving me a very wide berth.

[jotoole]

The mid-engine Box has a lower moment of inertia than a front or rear engine car. The car is more likely to spin. Just as when figure skaters spinning pull their arms and legs in closer to their bodies, there is a remarkable increase in spin. No gettin around it.

[Gforrest2]

Originally Posted by Ghostrider 310

shadrach74 Is on point, I lost an X19 on an off ramp at 19, (had all different brands of tires on it for those interested). Once you lose a mid engine you never forget it, it spins in a unique way and recovery is twitchy. I stored that experience and have always been gentle with all Porsche cars in the wet. I have also not pushed the spyder anywhere near as hard as the 986 in a corner yet as I am still learning the car characteristics.

Based on the accident you described it doesn't sound totaled if you get a roller donor car and do the work.

Thanks for the memories. I think I was about 19 when I spun my X1/9 on a freeway off ramp. Did a 360 and banged off both walls. Bald tires, wet pavement, too much speed and the characteristics of a mid-engine car.

[Frodo]

Originally Posted by jotoole

The mid-engine Box has a lower moment of inertia than a front or rear engine car. The car is more likely to spin. Just as when figure skaters spinning pull their arms and legs in closer to their bodies, there is a remarkable increase in spin. No gettin around it.

Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but I'm not sure this is true? My understanding (and, to some extent, my experience) is that, with the mid-engine design it's actually less likely to spin...BUT once she goes the figure skater phenomenon kicks in---the car then spins with reckless (and hopefully for the driver, "wreckless") abandon!

[shadrach74]

Originally Posted by Frodo

Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but I'm not sure this is true? My understanding (and, to some extent, my experience) is that, with the mid-engine design it's actually less likely to spin...BUT once she goes the figure skater phenomenon kicks in---the car then spins with reckless (and hopefully for the driver, "wreckless") abandon!

A mid engine car is more neutral and is somewhat less likely to "oversteer" than a rear engined car. However, when the word "spin" is mentioned that is what is really meant...as in like a top. I mid-engined car will spin unlike any other car because the CG is in the center.

[jacabean]

it does not take much to spin a boxster in the wet . PSM is a great system for those conditions . The damage he got is what you would get in any other car . no car can handle side impacts to the suspension and drive components .

[ekam]

There's no snap oversteer issues in the Boxster unlike the Toyota MR2... sounds like someone either has bald rear tires or suspension problem...

[san rensho]

Originally Posted by shadrach74

A mid engine car is more neutral and is somewhat less likely to "oversteer" than a rear engined car. However, when the word "spin" is mentioned that is what is really meant...as in like a top. I mid-engined car will spin unlike any other car because the CG is in the center.

Boxsters, even though they are mid engine, the center of mass is still in the rear, not as much as a 911, but still rear biased. I think what happens, at least what happened to me, is that when the rear starts to come around, your natural reaction is to lift off the gas and grab the brakes, which slows the whole car down. But the car is now sideways, and since the center of mass is towards the rear, the rear has more momentum , which will push the rear out even further leading to a spin.

The fix is counter intuative, stay on the gas so the car doesn't slow and countersteer, but it happens so fast that its hard to resist lifting and braking.

[ekam]

Originally Posted by jacabean

it does not take much to spin a boxster in the wet . PSM is a great system for those conditions .

The trouble with stability control is that it is as good as the tires on the car. If you have bald tires the world's best stability control will not save you.

[Bruce Wayne]

unfortunately the roads in the Uk are not as good as they should, or could be..

in some areas they are not unlike some that could be found around Lagos. what with worn surfaces, often damp and debris accumulating on the roads it doesn't take much, i've managed to 270 mine like it seems other have done.

also a bit of diesel spill on a damp road can make the sphincter tighten.

[rick3000]

Besides the fact that going only 15MPH in a Boxster in a roundabout is improbable. I am not surprised by the damage you listed. Think about it, 2000 lb's of metal is coming to a complete stop, and all of that energy is going through the rims, hubs, etc.

[san rensho]

Today I was watching a re-run of Top Gear and they made a comment that the old 911's were so prone to spinning in the wet that people would go roundabouts when it was raining to "watch bankers climb trees with their 911s."