should I buy this 1997 Boxster?
 

Hi Everyone


Just looking to get some input from you Porsche lovers that have owned one or more in the past.

Car I am considering is as follows:

1997 Porsche Boxster
58k miles
AC/heat works great .... for now!
Does NOT overheat
been in one minor accident in the past. didnt see any frame damage


Issues I am aware of after the inspection I did today:

1.) Water found its way behind the driver seat not allowing me to start it after turnied it off and looked at it today. I used a heat gun and dried the computer box area out for a little while and was able to started again and 3 times after .... so far so good I hope??

2.) The engine has a few Oil leaks on it. The oil pan and valve cover is leaking for sure ...... looks to be a decent size leak where the tranny meets up to the motor but not 100% sure.....may be a hose?? It leaks enough for a little amount of oil to drip. Doesnt look like it would be too hard to replace those gaskets but I may be wrong??

3.) The convert top has some missing and broken support brackets. I have never seen one complete so I am not sure what is missing exactly but I am still able to get the top up and down and drive it either way so.....

4.)It will need 2 new tires and new brake pads.

5.) The clutch seemed to work normal but I dont have another one to compare so ...... maybe assume that will need replacing sooner than later.

6.) the motor doenst make any unusual noises but then again it is stuck deep in there pretty good.


Questions:

1.) How much does a New or used under the driver seat computer cost? Can they be sent out to be rebuilt? Or once you dry them out and they work again..... are they good to go?

2.) Are oil leaks common or is this very unusual and maybe this particular Porsche was made on a friday? Everything seems pretty accessible from the bottom of the motor....are they pretty easy to work on?

3.) based on the pics below is the broken top parts going to cost major $$ to fix? This was a very common issue from what I have read, anyone out there provide alternatives?? Or what do/did most do when this happened to them?


I really really like driving the car and am able to fix most of the issues myself or at my buddies shop.... i think.

I got the guy down too $4400 for it due too all the issues ...... I think i can get him down too $4000 considering it may need a new computer due to the water entry but not sure

Just wondering what your thoughts may be regarding my possible purchase and being a first time Porsche owner Newb.

Thank you for reading and any help if much appreciated??????

I would not buy it based on the oil leaks. Not cheap at all to work on. It may have a leak on the RMS in which $$$$.$$

Thanks for the reply

But if I can get the car for $4400...... would that be a good enough deal to offset the leaks and other issues? I have a buddy that runs his own shop that should be able to do the RMS, IMS and clutch I assume ..... or do most shops not have the proper tools to work on Porsche??

I assume the oil leak is the rear main seal ..... sorta like oil is everywhere..... or could it be a leaky or loose oil hose?? If it was a RMS wouldnt the oil just sorta seep downward and not be everywhere?

the issues with the top dont bother me all that much, I have no problem getting out of the car and lifting the top up and down manually.

Pic attached of the leakage

also, maybe a stupid question but I will ask anyway.

The main leak at the tranny/enigne join seems to be coming from up above somewhere...... maybe below also but I think its leaking up top and leaking downward.

Any way something else can leak above and be miss-diagnosed as RMS/IMS??

when a RMS or IMS leaks ...... does it shoot oil out all over the surrounding area or would it just leak at the base of wear the tranny meet the engine?

Dose this make sense?

This may seem like a good deal but from the description it sounds like it's in rough shape and likely will turn into a money pit, quickly. What kind of maintenance has been documented? Oil leaks in the areas you described are not good signs. And the rest of the car doesn't sound like it was owned by an enthusiast. By the time you do the clutch, RMS, IMSR, tires, brakes, control module, and top you're propably close to an additional 4k into the car. Save on labor if you do most of it yourself. Not having seen the car in person, I would not recommend this car. Better to apply that 4k to a better maintained vehicle. But if you're confident you can tackle all the potential problems have fun with it and learn.

If you had the resources to turn this into a track car or buy a Jake Raby built engine, I'd say negotiate the price some more and get it.

People need to realize Porsches are not Hondas... if stuff breaks even if you fix it yourself, parts will cost you.

I see early model 986 as a $13-15k car... if you paid $9000 to buy it, it probably needs another $4k to fix. If it's $4k then you're probably going to spend more, a lot more to get it close to $13-15k.

Just ask our resident member RandallNeighbour...

I appreciate the input thus far fellas

How many hours is a RMS...IMS...and Clutch Job?? This is my main concern regarding the car of-course.

Should any competent mechanic that runs his own shop be able to tackle this repair process on a boxster? My buddy is a good mechanic but just wondering if there are things related too this repair that he may not be able to accomplish?

He is out of town right now so I am not really able to ask him questions and I am on a time crunch to buy this car if I want it. I have till today to decide if I want it for $4200 now.

Just trying to figure out what a buddy mechanic price might be for the RMS/IMS/clutch job a car should be........ someone must have had a friend do these repairs for them at one time or another?? $300 labor....$500 labor.....$1000 labor??????? He is a buddy but isnt going to do it for free if you know what I mean.

also what am I looking spending for just parts?

Sachs Clutch = $400
IMS = ??
RMS = ???
OIL change = $100
tranny fluid change = $100




when a RMS or IMS leaks ...... does it shoot oil out all over the surrounding area or would it just leak at the base of wear the tranny meet the engine?

Well, then, that makes me not feel all that bad about what I paid for my '97. :D

Personally, if I was buying this kind of car, I would want the overall cost to come in well, WELL under the price of a sound example needing no immediate work, both in terms of having a little leeway in case unexpected costs appear and also because it's a hassle, so you it it to come at a discount. It's the sort of thing that I think rarely adds up but can make sense with models that are fundamentally robust. Boxsters are fragile even when pampered - that's the worry.

If you could pick the car up for a couple of thousand, that leaves you with quite a lot of budget to work with.

I'll take a dissenting view from the other writers here and say you should grab it -- especially if you can take the car to a good independent Porsche shop that can tell you what the source of the oil is. And especially if you really like the car. $4400 is a good deal.

I bought a car with some of the same issues [water, brake pad & rotor replacement, top manual-only], and was able to get the repairs done for reasonable cost. Via the internet, you'll learn soon where to find used parts, acceptable aftermarket parts and how to work on the car.

A car is always a pig in a poke. As we read in nearly every thread here, the IMS failure & RMS issues and risks are present in nearly every 986 & 987 that hasn't had an upgrade. So this car is no different. All used cars need regular maintenance and replacement of parts.

The water issue will recur unless you either correct the leak or keep it out of the rain. Can you store the car in a covered place? If not, pick up a car cover on ebay. Also, it's unlikely a heat gun will eliminate the water, due to the thick, heavy foam that traps it under the carpets. The carpet must be removed and dried. Sounds like the computer can be saved, but you must remove that and dry it out. Fortunately in my car the computer was dry.

THE CHEAPEST BOXSTER YOU FIND AND BUY WILL BE THE MOST EXPENSIVE CAR YOU HAVE EVER OWNED.

... and your wife or girlfriend or parents and buddies will remind you of this every freaking day.

Save more money and buy a 2003 or newer model S and you will be far happier with your decision.

Thanks

I really like the car alot but am also very nervous. Its a blast to drive.


I went to start it this morning and it would not turn over or start ....... took heat gun too the electrical box again ........... and was able to get it started and running.

It idled a little rough and the check engine light came on and was blinking/flashing for about 40 seconds and then just stayed illuminated solid.

I just took it too autozone to have them run the codes.

apparently every cylinder 1-6 has a Miss-fire now and a oxygen sensor code also.


Im assuming the electrical box may be beyond saving and is causing the miss-fires and "check engine light too flash and then stay on ........... I dont know for sure.


Im going to see if the guy will take $3k for the car considering a new electrical box will need to be bought ...... for sure I think...... dont want to be left stranded becasue the electrical box issue.


Do these car typically have a sorta high pitch "exhaust note" sound at idle??

don't ever buy a Porsche as project car if you don't realize you are buying a project car.

I just spent $6K on major maintenace with a barely any upgrades on my pampered 10 year old Boxsters with 69K miles. And that was with small shop rates and I still have to do the shocks ($2K).
Driving a 10+ year old Porsche will cost you at least $10K. You can pay now or later but you will pay.

dirk, let me introduce myself first..my name is Gerry and I don't know much anything about car or about our Boxster except for putting the key to the ignition, drive it and bring to the indy shop that I trust to do all the maintenance work and other stuff..for short, I just drive, put gas and detail it every 6 months or when season change.

with that said...just reading thru all the things you've been finding out in the car, scares me :( IMHO...I won't touch it, even for $3K but that's me.

listen to Randall and PL..they've got experience about fixing our Boxster on their own pocket.

Dirk, it's too painful to read what I know is going to be a nightmare decision on your part. I am going to click the "submit reply" button on this thread comment and then remove myself from the comment tracking on it so I am not forced to relive the ********************-storm of repairs and problems I encountered when I bought a Boxster that was in even better running condition than the one you seem to be working overtime to justify purchasing.

I'm rarely this forward with new forum members, but I just gotta put it out there for what it's worth.

I know what you guys are saying ..... I was just hoping that any decent condition Porsche for $3k-$4k would be a killer deal that shouldnt be passed up.

Its just so fun to drive that I really really want it..... but the issues it has are abundant.

................. I would think for $3k I could part it out for more than that even if the motor blew up??

dirk, im saying this very nicely without bashing you or anything, ok? but it looks like you have made your decision already.


Good luck, buddy! Just remember, the forum is here when you end up buying it :cheers:

If you guys were me .... would you buy for $3k??

How does "doing shocks" equate to $2,000? Buying OEM units and paying to have them installed?
The whole RoW kit can be had for $1,100 at your door.

Where in the USA do you live? This can't be the only Box in a 500 mi radius. You'll like a well maintained, clean Box just as much as this one (I was going to say POS, but that wouldn't be nice). There are plenty for sale. Do some research before you toss $4K right out the window. There can't be a lot of buyers lining up for this one so there shouldn't be a need to act quickly. Calm down and look around.

Don't fall in love with the first one you see / drive. Randall and LB are trying to let you in on their experience. You were wise to come here and ask questions before buying. Now be doubley smart and listen to them.

This car has the makings of a good track car, that's all. Look for something else that is nice. You'll enjoy it more.

Good luck with your decision. Choose wisely, grasshoppa.

$1100 plus installation and 4 wheel alignment? Maybe he's going for PSS9? Perhaps he also needs new drop links as well?

<shrug>
He just said shocks. Doesn't make much sense to me, but I suppose with really nice shocks and labor it could be that much.

OEM S Shocks, springs, alignment (spec) and labor.. my indy quoted $1900.
Rate is $80 per hour. I don't see the point of doing that much labor and not puttin in new springs.

What's wrong with the springs? How many miles are on them?

I have a spare set of 2003 S 6-speed shocks and springs wth only 27,000 miles on them. They were removed for the installation of an M030 kit. I'll sell them to you way cheaper than that!

Thanks guys for all the help

my buddy said he could do the rms and Ims and clutch for $500 + cost of parts.

I think if the guy will come down to $3k for it I will buy it.

Worse case ...... The motor blows and I part it out

I assume there is a decent market for used parts from this car?? Even body panels gotta sell for decent money?

It's not so much if the motor blows that will be the issue. It's the $250, $500, and $1000 expenditures that it needs for each and every little item in order to make this car roadworthy. These "little things" are going to turn you upside down in a hurry.

Before you buy it, sit down and make a list of all the things it needs that you know about. Be sure to include O2 sensors. Do the windows work? How do the CV boots look? Those are items that generally need replacing. How bout the brake fluid, an antifreeze flush? Doesn't sound like this car had much maintenance done to it. Better throw those things in too. Price out the parts at Suncoast or Pelican. Add the labor that your friend will be charging. See what it costs. You'll be shocked.

This car has such a long list of known issues I can't imagine what unknowns are lurking.

At least do yourself a favor and test drive any other Boxster you can. There have to be garage queens available in your area that you can bargain down to the total cost of this mut.

The first thing I would look at is why this guy is willing to sell the car so cheap. I am guessing he knows it is a money pit and knows you are in for a real pain in the ass. I was in the same spot your in. I could have bought a 1998 for 6k. and decided to go with a 99 that was in mint condition for 12,000. I could not be happier because I get to drive the 99 and not just work on the 98. ;)

I am curious what it means when the check engine light flashes for a little while and then stays on solid??? anyone know??

also..... assuming the rear main-seal leak is the cause of the decent size oil leak.......... can i just check the oil very often and add as needed untill I get it fixed?? asking becasue I dont want the motor to blow on the drive home with it or something. Pretty much what can occur if the rear main-seal is leaking besides a little oil drippage?

I am willing to get dirty and work on the things I can myself ...... I generally only take my cars to buddies shop if there is no way I can possibly do it in my garage. I actually hate asking friends that own shops to do work for me. I use to rebuild sportbikes in college so I am pretty mechanically inclined .... not saying a sportbike is anything like a Porsche though.

I am also not one of those guys that needs everything on his car to be mint so some of the issues on this particular porsche dont bother me ..... such as the top being sorta message up. I have no problem getting out of the and putting it up and down carefully.


The guy is selling it so cheap becasue he is very very wealthy and moving out of the state very soon....... he really said he just needs it gone and doesnt really care. He is not a auto dealer or anything like that
My Girlfirend works for a automobile auction company and ran the car through for him already last week and the bidding got up too $6k for the car...... at that time the seller was hoping to get $7k-$8k out of the porsche so he declined the offer. Now as time has been getting closer to when he has to leave and the issues the car has have been brought to his attention he just has been letting it go for less and less. Now that I am interested in it my GF has been able to negotiate with him and pretty much giving me first crack at it at this point.

He obtained the car 2 years ago to help a friend of his out of a financial jam. He is very good friends with my Girlfriend but ..... the guy knows nothing about cars so isnt much help regarding the issues or maintenance.

Issues I know of?

keep in mind, car seems to run good and shift through gears normally.

- computer under seat got wet ... may be able to save but not sure.
- Flashing and then solid check engine light
- Autozone code scanner says missfire on couple cylinders and O2 sensor
- Rear main seal leak I think?? will change clutch regardless so these can be done then too
- 2 new tires needed
- converts top needs little work .... not a issue for me to fix this janky style
- Brakes soon


Can the the computer getting wet cause the check engine light and miss-fire issues?



If I can get it for $3k, I feel it will be a pretty good deal ........ worst case, motor blows and it becomes a $3k piece of garage eye candy I guess!!

A steady CEL is telling you there is a problem but you can drive on. A flashing CEL indicates there is a problem that could cause catastrophic damage to the engine and it means pull over and stop the engine ASAP. You should seriously look into this problem before going any further with the deal.

Yes, many just keep an eye on the oil level when RMS first appears as a little drip. If the issue is more than just a drip (which it sounds like this one is), be aware that you're dumping $5-$6 a quart oil into your engine / onto the ground. You don't want to do this for very long from an expense stand-point.

Dirk, its seems very obvious that your not actually asking for advice about whether you should buy this car or not, you have already decided to buy this car.
With that said, here is my 2 cents, DON'T BUY THIS CAR!
A month ago I was in a similar situation with a 1999 Boxster. I bought it, I regret it EVERY DAY and I do all the work myself. I can't IMAGINE having to pay a shop to do work on it. EVERYTHING on a Boxster is OVERPRICED and these engines are FULL of major problems. The only reason I have not sold mine as parts is because I LOVE the Boxster look and drive and am willing to sink HUGE amounts of money into my engine to upgrade and improve it so I can enjoy it (at a high yearly cost) for years to come.
Dirk, if you don't believe me you will, I have only been heavily involved in Boxsters for a little over a month and have already experienced a D-chunk #3 cylinder on the one I bought(81K). Then went to buy a used block that had a slipped sleeve I was not told about(67K on it) (refused the block after driving 12 hours to pick it up). Then bought another used block that I have now discovered has a catistrophic IMS bearing that has done damage to the IM Shaft main sprocket(81K)(drove 9 hours for this one). Luckily now I have 2 blocks that I can build into 1 and keep my bearing carrier with a good block to avoid RMS issues (fingers crossed).
Doesn't it seem strange to you that I have found THREE low mileage Boxster engines that have CATISTROPHIC DAMAGE? Its not strange, these engines are GARBAGE and unless you like this car enough to drop more money into it then its worth in the first place, walk away. I have to replace my piston rings after splitting my block, they are $900 for the set and there are no aftermarket rings available!!! I've never spent more then $300 on a set of piston rings in my life! Just another expense that you will soon be taking on (if your lucky and thats all you have to do) if you buy this car.
I am an experienced mechanic and this is not a simple little engine to do work on and it WILL need work done on it!!
Unless your willing to buy this car for $3000 and then send it to Innovative 6 and spend an additional $15k to have the motor built the way Porsche should have in the first place, don't do it!
Okay, I feel better, Ive said what I need to say..... I need a cigarette and I don't even smoke!

hey Peterborough, wanna build a second motor while you're at it lol

HA, very funny. My block comes back from the machine shop Monday and then I can start re-assembling. Talk to me after I've scraped and cut my knuckles for a while and you might have a deal. LOL

The more replies I read, the more nervous I am becoming. :-(......

I do really love the way the car looks, drives and sounds ...... and now that I am older and too much of a sissy to drive sport-bikes any-longer ..... I really need a convertible sports car.

Anyone else ever had the check engine light flash for a little while and then stay light solid??

Is it possible that the water logged failing Computer under the seat can cause the check engine light to flash.

Im just trying to see what has caused this to happen on other peoples bosxters??


If I do get the car.....which at this point is a 50/50, I will be having the RMS, IMS and clutch replaced asap ........ Thinking that may cost $1500-ish? Buddy said he can do the labor for around $700-ish.

is the IMS bearing part itself real expensive??

Go read about IMS failures, Retrofit kits and installation instructions on LN Engineering and Flat6Innovation's websites. I don't recall exactly but I think it's around $650 for the retrofit kit.
If I was to do it over, I would not have bought my Boxster knowing what I know now even though my car has been relatively trouble free. There are just too many issues with it. I do love how the car drives and looks though.

I just bought an IMS bearing from LN Engineering for the engine I'm building. It was a double row bearing which should be the same as the 1997. It cost $595 plus tax and delivery.

Also yes, a waterlogged OBC under the seat can cause a CEL to come on. Go buy a code reader from any automotive store and plug it in to the Porsche, it will tell you why the light is on. And after your done with it, return it or keep it. I guarentee you will use it again. I bought ones a couple years ago and have used it countless times on countless vehicles.

There could be a myriad of reasons for the CEL. You can be certain you'll need to replace the computer (not impressive to your date when you pull out a hair dryer to start it). You could also have bad O2 sensors messing things up. Or it could be something else that will manifest itself after you've done these two replacements. The thing is, you can spend a pile of bucks chasing it.

You keep saying you love the way this box looks, drives and sounds. Other boxs will give you that same feeling without having that sucking sound of money flying out of your wallet.

Let me ask you - what are you able to afford? Is your budget only $4K so you think you can afford this box on a budget? Check out past posts about maintenance and you'll find wise owners of older boxs annually put $1500 into a maintenance fund. Spending your entire allotment for a problem child box is really going to send you upside down. If you can't afford a $9K box, you better wait or become friendly with a banker. If you think this $3K box is going to be cheap, you're in for a surprise. By the time you get done fixing everything, you'll have at least $7K invested. If you repair as you can afford it, you'll be driving this box in a couple of yrs but by then nice boxs will be worth $7K.

The autozone computer scanner said the check engine light was on due too O2 sensor and miss-fire on some of the cylinders. I guess it could be saying it has a miss-fire becasue the computer under seat is wet ...... this is assuming the little computer under the seat controls the ignition.......

The aftermarket better IMS bearing cost $550?? ..... gezzz $550 for just a bearing seems nuts?? or are there other parts included?

I see what everyone is saying about it being a money pit but what if i find nice bosxter for $8-$9k and it still needs a new updated IMS bearing and clutch and other odds and ends.

At least if i can get the car for $3k, put money into it and know for sure all the necessary parts have been replaced .... VS ..... buying a nicer boxster for $9k and end up having to replace some of the same expensive stuff anyways ......

I think I may just flip a coin to make my decision and let fate decide for me ...... Im Torn now