3.6 motor swap into 986 base or only S?

[jwade]

Ike that is incredible!! Pictures are great. My lil bro lives in Tellurude and I just got back from there. Absolutely love the rockies....

In all seriousness, what does something like that run? please pm me. Thx, Jon

[23109VC]

thanks for the info.

part of why i ask - is that *IF* I do get a used boxster, and I just "accept" that i might get an IMS failure and need a new motor - I can know what my options will be.

what is the general cost - to get one of these large motors put in?

lets say I don't go crazy and get a RUF motor - but just go to the dealer and say "put in the newer engine from the 911".

is it going to cost me a lot more than what it would cost to put in the same boxster engine? my dad is offering to sell me his 2000 base. it has the 2.7 motor with 73k miles. i coudl pick it up pretty cheap - like 13-14k. if i drove that around for a year or two, and it made it that far - i'd either get my "money's worth out of it" and eventually sell it - or I'd wind up another victim of IMS failure and have to put in a motor.

if I were to take that car, walk into the porsche dealer and get a quote for either the same 2.7 motor OR the larger 911 egnine - is it basically the same cost? can the dealer put in the larger 911 engine? or do I pay big time through the nose to "upgrade" to the larger engine and do I have to find custom shops to do it?

do you get any kind of warranty on these porsche motors? are they truly NEW or are they rebuilds?

i can imagine a boxster that weighs around 2900-3000 lbs would be a frickin rocket with a 300+ hp motor.

from my quick research, it looks like the 3.4L 911 motor that would go into a 2000 base Boxster - is rated at 300 hp, 258lb torque. that's pretty powerful...but any more so than a new boxster S? i don't think so...so I"m guessing that for tha tminey, essentially my 2000 boxster would perform similarly to a new boxster S....in terms of raw acceleration... excpet my car would have a 5 speed, not a 6.

is that good or bad - to have a 5 speed that was meant to go with a 2.7 mated up to a large rmore powerful motor vs having the S's 6 speed??


does all that power upset the balance of the car? like others have said - the balance of the car is what is so fun. when I drive my dad's car, it's only rated at 217 hp. it feels quick, but by no means is it "FAST". but when an onramp comes up, or a set of twisties - OMFG. the combo of 18s, M030, and balance - the thing is FLAT, and just goes through the turns like nothign I"ve ever driven before. it is literally glued to the road...i love it. i'd hate to make the car into some spin out prone type of car because the power overwhelmed the car..

or does the car drive just the same, only way faster.

[angman]

I think that you expecting an IMS or RMS faliure at 100%. I hope you're not too dissapointed if you run into a good model, drive the heck out of it only to find that the motor holds up fine. There are many members here that have very reliable engines as well. At that point you might be stuck with the question, do I go ahead and do engine swap anyway since my engine looks like it won't blow up. whatever engine you get, you should still have a big grin on your face.

[23109VC]

i think you misread the intent of my thread.

I am actually hoping that I find a boxster that DOES NOT blow up. I want to find a nice clean car and drive it - and enjoy it - stock.

I was just wondering - since i have read of failures - if there was some year/model that would prevent someone from upgrading to a better motor - if when it failed. just so I wouldn't have a choice between say a 2000 and 2001 that I liked equally - only to later find out that the 2000 can't get upgrded but 2001 models were great for swapping in a larger engine..

what I have found out is that it doesn't really matter.

so I can shop for any 986 and know that IF I buy one - and IF I was unfortuante enough to have an engine problem and I had to replace it - I could buy a bigger/faster engine if I wanted to.

i honestly would love nothig more than to spend a modest sum, get a nice clean base 986 and just enjoy it. I'd be happy with that..don't even need an S.

the sound of that engine is musical.

[Adam]

Just a rough guess, but i'd say if you did want to swap in a 911 engine instead of just another 2.7L the difference in price would probbaly be 5-10k. Remember the newer boxsters have gained some weight too, so a 2000 boxster with a 3.4L should be a tad faster than a new 2008 S with a 3.4L as well.

[nefarious986]

Hey Ike, can you give a rough estimate in $ how much RUF charged to put the x51 into your car?

I caught the power bug .. bad .. and I need help.

[JP-s-in st. louis]

I will let you know next week! :dance:

Further details to follow but let us just say that 500 is a good sounding number.

[easyc]

Originally Posted by 23109VC

thanks for the info.

part of why i ask - is that *IF* I do get a used boxster, and I just "accept" that i might get an IMS failure and need a new motor - I can know what my options will be.

what is the general cost - to get one of these large motors put in?

you are looking at anywhere from 3-10K for the engine, with the low end being a used 2.7 to the 10K being a pristine rebuilt 3.6... then you can add anywhere from 20-50+ hours of shop time depending on the engine and what has to be done to make it work... you can then add another 2K for misc. stuff if you are doing a 911 swap....


lets say I don't go crazy and get a RUF motor - but just go to the dealer and say "put in the newer engine from the 911". Ruf swaps are VERY expensive... A simple 3.4 swap into a 986 will probably run you 20+K

is it going to cost me a lot more than what it would cost to put in the same boxster engine? my dad is offering to sell me his 2000 base. it has the 2.7 motor with 73k miles. i coudl pick it up pretty cheap - like 13-14k. if i drove that around for a year or two, and it made it that far - i'd either get my "money's worth out of it" and eventually sell it - or I'd wind up another victim of IMS failure and have to put in a motor. Any 911 swap is going to cost you much more... a 3.4 swap into any 986 up to 01 will not be that much more, but you can count on having to buy headers and other misc on top of the rest... if you go the 3.6 route into a 02+ it would be the same... the reason for this is electronics... if you try to mix those engines and years (e.g. 3.6 into a 99) then you are looking at switching from a 7.2 to a 7.8 Motronic... thats not an easy task, and many shops will not even try.

if I were to take that car, walk into the porsche dealer and get a quote for either the same 2.7 motor OR the larger 911 egnine - is it basically the same cost? can the dealer put in the larger 911 engine? or do I pay big time through the nose to "upgrade" to the larger engine and do I have to find custom shops to do it? big time through the nose at a custom shop... and odds are that shop wont be that close to you..... I wouldn't even start to pay dealer price anyways.... you could always try to do the swap yourself....... like i have

do you get any kind of warranty on these porsche motors? are they truly NEW or are they rebuilds? the 3.4 and 3.6 you find are rebuilt by porsche... others are just pulled from junkers.... the rebuilt engines have some kind of warranty, but Ive never bought one

i can imagine a boxster that weighs around 2900-3000 lbs would be a frickin rocket with a 300+ hp motor.

from my quick research, it looks like the 3.4L 911 motor that would go into a 2000 base Boxster - is rated at 300 hp, 258lb torque. that's pretty powerful...but any more so than a new boxster S? i don't think so...so I"m guessing that for tha tminey, essentially my 2000 boxster would perform similarly to a new boxster S....in terms of raw acceleration... excpet my car would have a 5 speed, not a 6. Actually the older boxster would be considerably quicker given it weighs a few hundred pounds less and the close ratio of the 5 speed when compared to that of the 6 speed

is that good or bad - to have a 5 speed that was meant to go with a 2.7 mated up to a large rmore powerful motor vs having the S's 6 speed?? Thats debatable, but Ive never heard of a 5-speed going out after a swap... but the 6speed is more powerful... a guy in australia is running the same unit mated to a MKI GT3 engine... and Tholyoak is running a 5-speed mated to a 3.6x51


does all that power upset the balance of the car? like others have said - the balance of the car is what is so fun. when I drive my dad's car, it's only rated at 217 hp. it feels quick, but by no means is it "FAST". but when an onramp comes up, or a set of twisties - OMFG. the combo of 18s, M030, and balance - the thing is FLAT, and just goes through the turns like nothign I"ve ever driven before. it is literally glued to the road...i love it. i'd hate to make the car into some spin out prone type of car because the power overwhelmed the car..

or does the car drive just the same, only way faster. Of course its going to change how the car drives... it emphasizes the boxster;s need for a LSD, but the cars balance, turn in, and grip will not change.... its only putting more power down that matters... also if you are seriously going to run a early boxster at the track with a big 911 swap, you should upgrade to 986S brakes

Hope that helps

[Ike]

Hey Sportsfans,

My opinion as to your question of Boxster Balance (mightyfine) after my power upgrade to 355+HP:

Balance

The nice static balance is hardly changed at all. The new engine is very close to the same weight. The low center of gravity mid engine configuration is intact. The Boxster S drive train is able to put the extra power to the ground strong and smoothly, no hop, chatter, or twist. This is not adding a 327 to a Vega Adding a girlfriend can upset the balance more.

Driver Input

There is the matter of Driver Input though. With more power available, the course of the car can be altered around the apex by exceeding the rear tires' ability to grip the road surface. The rear tires have to grip under both the forward (hammerdown) and lateral (oh $*# guardrail) forces. Crudely, the butt can step out if you mash it in a hard turn. Again, this is not a balance issue to me, but a driver input. This is a skill that is so fun to learn, potentially disasterous if in error.

Better Balance under Power

Better tires can increase the overall balance under power. I have a suspension upgrade that lowers the center of gravity, supresses body roll and tends to keep the inside tires with stronger contact, improving the "balance" under power and lateral loads. For the same reasons, the stock S model is better than the base model under these conditions.

The addition of a Limited Slip Differential &/or Traction Control can keep the rear tires in better contact under power, hence better balance. I will defer to the true gearheads of this forum as to the availability of these options on the 986-7. A great illustration of this interaction between balance and power could be seen when F1 eliminated traction control this year!

My power lunch is up, its back to the shed for me. :dance:

Hasta,
Ike

[wild1poet2]

Will the Boxster tranny stand up to a 3.8L upgrade?

[Adam]

Originally Posted by wild1poet2

Will the Boxster tranny stand up to a 3.8L upgrade?

I know the 6spd boxster S tranny will. I think the 5 spd tranny will to, but I don't know that for a fact.

[Cloudsurfer]

The 6-speed is a stouter box, but plenty of guys are running around on 5-speeds with bigger motors. Adding an LSD would certainly be nice, though.

Patrick