Measurements of Lowered Boxsters

[insite]

Originally Posted by Benny986

do you know what your exact spring rates are?

i am running C/Os, granted I have motons, and the ride is VERY plush.

spring rates with the same shocks can drastically change the ride characteristics. as can the wrong tire and wrong air pressure.

i have the re01-r. which i like a lot.

the RE01-R is a VERY comfortable tire.

[Gary in BR]

My current spring rates are 300 front and 500 rear.

I know these are very stiff, my original thought is to just go with softer springs. Most spring rates for the 986 are 200-300 range. The reason I am considering just going to a Bilsten-H&R setup is I will only have to do the work once.

DO you guys think softening the springs will help with the "porpoising" I am getting?

[fishyfishfish]

Another interesting point, which should have been obvious to me (preferably, before I purchased them), is that the after-market camber plates are relatively thick... the ones I bought, schnell, which seem to be as good or the same as all the other ones, are 1/2" thick, so by using them i will be able to get more camber (duh) than stock allows, but i'm also going to be raising the car higher, changing the lower front/higher rear setup of the factory M030 and probably affecting the handling characteristics in a negative way (e.g. more understeer)... so, now, the only way i will now be able to alleviate the understeer and or get the ride height back to the way i love it, is to get adjustable coilovers!!! Thus, like insite, I may be looking to trade/sell my MO30 package as well...

Oh, the webs we weave!

[fishyfishfish]

And just to make myself feel even worse for buying adjustable camber plates ($400) that might not be useful without adjustable coilovers and/or adjustable swaybar/perches, i did a google search and found these probably great -- though not "name brand" -- adjustable coilovers WITH camber plates online for around $1000. Although I'm new to the boxster world, unfortunately, I'm used to this kind of buyer regret(s) being a mac user my whole life and "loving" the feeling of getting a new computer delivered, turning it on, and finding the same computer online for a hundred bucks cheaper in the time it took me to get the new one delivered.

http://www.autozconcept.com/product_info.php?products_id=263

[renzop]

FishyFishFish,

Nothing f**ks up a car more than bargain coilovers. Dont't regret missing out on cr*p. I have seen these things advertised under at least 10 different brand names. Check out some Honda sites. They have the same ones for $600.

The problem with these and other cheap coilovers are the crummy adjustment mechanisms that jam after just a few months use and the poor rebound control and lack of real adjustability for low speed rebound.

If you want to save monet do it on springs but stick with name brand shocks or coilovers. And always match your shock rates to your spring rates. If a shock company can't tell you the range of spring rates for their shock then move on.

So, be happy that you "missed out" on this "bargain"

Regards,
Alan

[fishyfishfish]

Sound advice, and as far as these coilovers go, i'll take your word for it so thanks for the warning... however, i've found that the korean and/or chinese copies of overpriced european goodies marketed to porschephiles who automatically equate (over) price with quality are usually just as good -- the chinese headers on ebay being the best example... i could not tell the difference between the $100 ones and a pair of $1000 at my local porsche mechanic in santa monica, nor could the buyers, or the mechanic. but of course one was a brand that advertised in "Excellence" and one was not.

[chaudanova]

Gary, I have a Brand New set of RoW M030 "S" Springs... if you're interested in them, PM me.

[Benny986]

Originally Posted by Gary in BR

My current spring rates are 300 front and 500 rear.

I know these are very stiff, my original thought is to just go with softer springs. Most spring rates for the 986 are 200-300 range. The reason I am considering just going to a Bilsten-H&R setup is I will only have to do the work once.

DO you guys think softening the springs will help with the "porpoising" I am getting?

thats actually kinda of soft, and the range is interesting. i'm not too family with boxster spring setup, but is the 200lb difference front to rear normal?

i have 400s up front and 550 in the back. i also have a dual spring setup, so its actually a bit higher than that.

i also have higher canister pressures up front than out back. by about 100lbs i think.

my ride is very comfy.

are you on 19s? go back to 18s if so. what is your exact setup now? and describe how the car rides.

and by porpoising. do you mean that under acell, the front end seems to lift up? if so, i think our cars just do that.

[mn box s]

This thread got me down in my parking garage... and yes my car is still there ( a little dusty). Ok after measurements I was suprised to see by this style of measuring height that it was an even 4. All came in at 24-1/8" with 235/35/19 & 265/30/19 on oo' S running KW V2's with about 3" more to go in front and 3/4" to go in rear um dont think it would drive like that let alone get the jack out!

[Gary in BR]

Originally Posted by mn box s

This thread got me down in my parking garage... and yes my car is still there ( a little dusty). Ok after measurements I was suprised to see by this style of measuring height that it was an even 4. All came in at 24-1/8" with 235/35/19 & 265/30/19 on oo' S running KW V2's with about 3" more to go in front and 3/4" to go in rear um dont think it would drive like that let alone get the jack out!

Ok Mn Box we need to talk.
You are running your suspension lower than mine (and I thought I was low) and you have the same type 349 19 inch rims I have.

How is your ride?
What size tires are do you have on the car?
Maybe my coilovers just suck!!

[mn box s]

Well I do know that camber (extreme) will wear tires fast. Im getting 2k miles on my rears ( three sets rear) about 70% on the fronts still. So I just purchased rear toe adjuster rods. My toe is waaaayy out and hope this will get me to about 5-6k on my rears. Id be happy with that its not like Im trying to get 20+k on the things.

I love my suspension! Yes I come from a long line of slammmmmed cars its not low enough until you cant barely drive it. .....Rides good! Just cant pull into my driveway from the left at over 5mph or Ill pull the left front fender off.

Might be some pics at my clubs myspace site TC Echelon or TCECHELON.COM

About bump stops on factory type suspension they are external and made of a hard foam usually orangish. Most performance suspensions have them internally and no you probably wont hear it if you hit it. It will feel like the suspension stopped moving downward abruptly and your car will basicly launch into the air. While your body feels sharp spine compaction and your kiddneys and organs go whoah! or something like that.

[Benny986]

ok curiosity got the better of me.

i am at 25 3/16 all around. from floor to the bottom of the fender.

2K and you want 5-6K mileage??? SERIOUSLY! Umm, thats all TOE, toe kills tires way faster than camber.

I drive my car hard, and i autox, and I plan on getting 12k-15K on my tires.

porpoising... umm, do this, drive on a bumpy road, have someone drive behind you, or next to you. does that wheel still bounce up and down several seconds after you have hit that bump? If so, that shock is blown. There is no dampening, and you are just basically relying on the spring for your suspension in that corner.

[Gary in BR]

Originally Posted by mn box s

Well I do know that camber (extreme) will wear tires fast. Im getting 2k miles on my rears ( three sets rear) about 70% on the fronts still. So I just purchased rear toe adjuster rods. My toe is waaaayy out and hope this will get me to about 5-6k on my rears. Id be happy with that its not like Im trying to get 20+k on the things.



I installed a set of adjustable toe arms on my rear tires a few thousand miles ago. The car drives better and I am noticing less tire wear. I bought mine from Tarrett Enginering but I think Board sponsor Deluboz sells them also





I love my suspension! Yes I come from a long line of slammmmmed cars its not low enough until you cant barely drive it. .....Rides good! Just cant pull into my driveway from the left at over 5mph or Ill pull the left front fender off.

Might be some pics at my clubs myspace site TC Echelon or TCECHELON.COM




I looked at your clubs site and the pictures appear to be prior to lowering the car.
Do you have any with the car lowered?





About bump stops on factory type suspension they are external and made of a hard foam usually orangish. Most performance suspensions have them internally and no you probably wont hear it if you hit it. It will feel like the suspension stopped moving downward abruptly and your car will basicly launch into the air. While your body feels sharp spine compaction and your kiddneys and organs go whoah! or something like that.

Your final paragraph describes my issue.
I have adjustable dampening on my coilovers, as of now they are in the soft setting, would firming the dampening fix this? Make it better? or Gary get those things off of your car?

I think I will try firming them a couple of clicks and see how that does.

[Gary in BR]

Originally Posted by Benny986

thats actually kinda of soft, and the range is interesting. i'm not too family with boxster spring setup, but is the 200lb difference front to rear normal?




From looking at other coil over setups most do not have spring rates this high most are in the 200 - 300 range.





i have 400s up front and 550 in the back. i also have a dual spring setup, so its actually a bit higher than that.



i also have higher canister pressures up front than out back. by about 100lbs i think.
my ride is very comfy.
are you on 19s? go back to 18s if so. what is your exact setup now? and describe how the car rides.


I am going to ride on my OEM 17s for a week and see how it feels, that way I can decide if its the coil overs or the low profile rims.





and by porpoising. do you mean that under acell, the front end seems to lift up? if so, i think our cars just do that.

Porpoising may not be the term, I read it a few places and it is close to describing what I have going on. When I hit a dip in freeway the rear of the car feels as if it lifts off the ground, and once I know for a fact it did. If I hit a bump the same thing happens it feels as if the rear of the car is near coming off the ground.

AS far as any other driving the car is just fine, firm but thats what I wanted, al I want to solve is the rear end feeling, When I drove with the 19s and OEM struts and Elbachs I don't recall ever feeling this.

[mn box s]

-Porpoising may not be the term, I read it a few places and it is close to describing what I have going on. When I hit a dip in freeway the rear of the car feels as if it lifts off the ground, and once I know for a fact it did. If I hit a bump the same thing happens it feels as if the rear of the car is near coming off the ground.


Have you ruled out hitting your bump stops? I have seen this occur under those circumstances.

[Gary in BR]

Hitting the bump stops is a high possibility.
Now I will feel like a retard but I would assume if it was hitting the bump stops I would hear it?
The car does not make any noises from the suspension.
Is there a way to see if its hitting the bump stops?

[boxs2000]

DO you guys think softening the springs will help with the "porpoising" I am getting?[/QUOTE]

Just a thought, your porpoising may be from the flex you are getting as the result of removing your center support where your inter-cooler now sits. As stiff as your suspension is set at, I really don't see how your car would be porpoising. It may be that as your car dips and the shocks are stiff, your actual suspension arms are flexing since there is no support to keep them together. Just a thought...

[Gary in BR]

Originally Posted by boxs2000

DO you guys think softening the springs will help with the "porpoising" I am getting?

Just a thought, your porpoising may be from the flex you are getting as the result of removing your center support where your inter-cooler now sits. As stiff as your suspension is set at, I really don't see how your car would be porpoising. It may be that as your car dips and the shocks are stiff, your actual suspension arms are flexing since there is no support to keep them together. Just a thought...[/QUOTE]


Very possible, i have a complete set of bars on their way to me. it may be two weeks until i can get them on.

After driving the car more today the problem may be solved. I went over a few dips on the road today that normally would create the unsettled feeling today the car did not give me the impression i was launching into the air.

i am going to tweek it a little more tomorrow with my new found knowledge of boxster suspensions and will report back shortly.