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wicked vibration through-out entire car
So, just got back from Phoenix and had a terrible drive back!
At first I thought maybe it was just the road, but after about 50 miles, I determined, naw it's definitely the car. At any rate, the entire 340 or so mile trip I had this wicked vibration (almost like a stutter) through the entire car- I felt it in the steering wheel, the dead pedal, the floor board and could even see the passenger seat vibrating like crazy (could feel it for sure when I put my hand on the seatback). Some of you may remember that I posted a thread a while back about a very fine, rapid (almost machine-like) vibration I'd feel in the gas pedal between 3k and 4k rpm's, which the dealer said they couldn't feel. Well, I'm wondering if this little demon has grown into something worse! I didn't hit anything, didn't run over anything and didn't change anything on the car after arriving in Phoenix. Drive there was perfect - no car-wide vibration and the car actually sat for the day until I came home today. :( :mad: Of course, first thought is tire out of round or unbalanced, but seems a bit random to just happen! Any thoughts as to what this entire vibration is? I'll tell you, I felt like I was driving an 82 Camaro and pushing it to go 85mph rather than a Porsche that should feel fluid at 80mph (actually I'd expect the damn thing to feel fluid at 145mph). But I'll tell you, it felt frickin unstable even at 85mph! I'm not too happy right now!! :mad: |
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I get the 3-4k vibration in my car as well. Dealer claims they dont feel anything or its the road..... I have had 2 set of wheels and maybe 4set of tires and it did it with all of them...Still cant figure it out. MNBoxster suggested it could be an alignment issue which i wouldnt doubt but i havent had the time to take it to get realigned Do you have any aftermarket suspension work done????Because i do.... |
TriGem - no aftermarket work to the suspension, yet and no wheel spacers. However, this vibration is almost what I'd think would occur with a crappy pair of wheel spacers. So, maybe while my car sat in Phoenix, the crappy wheel spacer fairy came and installed a set of makeshift spacers on my car, unbeknownst to me!
I think I'm gonna start adopting the service/dealer mentality when I see patients - Patient: I'm bleeding out of my eyes Doctor: I don't see any blood those are just red tears! Stop your crying! - here's your bill for $1000 Porsche owner: my (expensive, non-domestic, supposedly non-****************ty made) car has this vibration Porsche Service: I don't feel any vibration - hey, how did my soda get shaken up while I test drove your car - hmmm go figure. Anyway, here's your bill for $2000 and yes, we did charge you $15 per minute for that rental car, which by the way wasn't a Porsche! |
It's possible you could have lost a balance weight from one of your wheels. This can cause a sudden onset of severe vibration.
It is more common on steel rims that use clamp-on weights, but not unknown on alloys where the weights are attached with an adhesive. |
I hate to say this, but if you rule out tires or wheels or wheel balancing, you should look at your suspension and motor mounts. That's gonna hurt the wallet, but may be the source of your teeth-rattling vibration.
Keep us posted so we can all learn about what to do when this happens to us! |
The stuttering nature of the vibration really gave me the sense that it was originating in the suspension or drivetrain, rather than from the wheels/tires. Especially with how unstable the car felt.
I agree with you Randall, that if it is a suspension or motor mount issue that could be high dollar, but as my car is new with only 4000 miles, I'm expecting the cause and repair to be 100% covered by Porsche. If not, I'll gladly drive the car through the showroom window for them! (Anyone remember that old Discount Tire commercial where the old lady throws the tire through the store window?) I'll stop by the dealership either on Mon or Tues to begin the process of: Me: there's a vibration Dealer: no there isn't Me: Uh, huh Dealer, na uh me: uh, huh, stupid dealer: na, uh, i'm telling you called me stupid 10 minutes later - Fox news - an unidentified man drove off with new 911 from a soCal Porsche dealership and has been spotted driving along southern california freeways yelling - see, this one doesn't vibrate!!!!!!!!!!!!! |
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triGem - not sure I can this weekend, but maybe early this week??
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Let me know...Shoot me an email at JDemircift@gmail.com
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LOL! Mach, keep those scripts coming :p |
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The vibration is felt everywhere, almost like the car is falling apart.
But, it is usually only felt when cruising or dropping in rpms/slowing down. It is almost never felt when accelerating because you get past the "weak spot" (around 3200rpm) so fast you wouldn't even notice it. |
can anyone else confirm this (especially my 987 brethren out there)? This crazy-ass, my car is falling apart, I wouldn't run this on a straightline, all over vibration is NORMAL? Wait, I thought I bought a Porsche - fine, german engineering????
Is there a hidden badge on the car that actually identifies it as being constructed in Tijuana??? A friend with an A4 had a similar kind of all over vibration and it turned out the be an ignition coil problem - something Audi ended up doing a recall for? Thoughts? I mean, is Porsche sending up a smoke screen because they're not sure why this happens? BruceLee - any of the 911's you have demonstrate a similar phenomenon??? to the dealer tomorrow - keep your eyes posted on Fox news (OJ got nothing on me!) :cheers: |
From another thread:
There's an issue in the 3000-3300 RPM range with the dual-mass flywheel that's standard on the Boxster. I feel it all the time, mostly in the seat. Mine started a few months ago. The problem is similar to a warped rotor, but since the flywheel moves so much faster it's a vibration you feel rather than a shaking like you would get from a brake rotor. The range widens over time and mileage. |
Time to Upgrade
Sounds like its time to upgrade to a Sachs lightweight flywheel and performance clutch.
KRZ |
yeah - if i'm replacing anything in this new car because it has to be, rather than because I want to for peformance gains, aesthetics, etc - than by golly I'll replace the car!
On the other hand, if this were a 75k mileage car or a 5+ yr old car that required a new clutch and flywheel because of normal wear and tear, my stance would be a lil different. But, crap - 4000 miles on a car that's supposed to be better than the domestics and asian imports and already has a rattle and hum (not courtesy of U2) that makes me think, hmmm road trip this weekend - yeah, maybe we'll take the wife's subaru!!!! :confused: |
It sounds like a classic case of either demonic possession or aliens attempting to communicate with you via your Boxster. If the Boxster starts spinning around on it's mid-engine axis or you get the uncontrollable urge to mold your mashed potatoes into Devil's Tower, you'll know which for sure.
Glad I could help. |
sd- in fact, just the other day, I began shoveling trash and dirt into my kitchen window after I swore the boxster moved it's front trunk up and down and in not so feminine voice - urged me to build it...
my wife promptly said that she wasn't terri garr and to immediately get the dirt the f*(& out of the kitchen!!! |
What about the vibration issue with the faulty oil relief valve? There is a TSB out on this. Looks like an easy fix too. Go look over on the RennTech site for more details. Loren there had a good post with the engine numbers involved on some specific 2005's.
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mach schnell, the TSB# is ENU1726 for the following engines:
The TSB says the new control spring is "as of": Engines manufactured since December 5, 2005 as of engine numbers: M96.25 61 6 04763 M96.26 62 6 03668 The date is not that important (except that if your car was built before that date it couldn't have the new control spring). If your engine number is below the engine numbers above (depending on model) -- then you need the new control spring. You can find your engine number in either your warrenty book or owners manual. I don't remember which. It is in the first few pages. I hope this is helpful, but your vibration sounds like it is much worse than the issue covered by this TSB. Good luck and let us know how it works out with the dealer. |
bmussati - so are you saying that if I have an engine number DIFFERENT than either the two you listed, I potentially have the faulty oil relief valve? Or are those the engine numbers that are specific to the faulty oil relief valve?
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mach schnell, sorry. I edited the statement to include:
The date is not that important (except that if your car was built before that date it couldn't have the new control spring). If your engine number is below the engine numbers above (depending on model) -- then you need the new control spring. |
Hi,
The speculation here is all over the Map. But, most vibrations are either RPM or MPH dependent. If RPM, then look to the Drivetrain, if MPH, then suspect the Tires, Suspension. I'm going for the latter based on what you've described. Good Luck!... Happy Motoring!... Jim'99 |
in leiu of the tires magically falling out of balance, what is the likelihood that the suspension is f-ed up in a new car with 4k miles (no sarcasm here - real question). i have to admit, i feel like the car is wobbly even on gentle corners (even with sport-mode engaged) - however, i may just be imagining every little thing until i get to the bottom of this vibration!
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I can't imagine an issue with the Suspension on such a new car, except if something wasn't properly torqued on the Assembly Line and has now shifted. But, have you hit any pot holes, curbs, speed bumps, even a sharp driveway, or the like? You could have delaminated a Tire causing the vibration. Your Tires and Suspension are virtually new. Well, manufactured things tend to fail at one of two stages - in their infancy or old age. The first because of poor manufacture or assembly, the latter due to old age and simply wearing out. In either event, everything discussed here is sheer speculation and can only be confirmed by visiting the dealer, or a tire & alignment shop and getting these things properly measured to insure they're within spec. Gonna cost some time and maybe some $$, but there's no other way except to live with it, which I certainly would not. Hope this helps... Happy Motoring!... Jim'99 |
well - 987 going into Walter's monday morning to sit while they come up with reasons why there is no vibration :rolleyes:
incidently, i throughout the idea of the control spring for the oil relief valve as a culprit and the service rider was clueless! who knows - will provide updates next week. by the way - re: loaner car - Angie, the service rider confirmed when I made the appt today, that I'd have a loaner car ready monday morning when I drop my car off - no charge, unless I upgrade to the MB. |
Mach, there's something you should know about warranty work at Porsche dealerships that I just learned from my mechanic, who is a tech at a dealership.
Rattles, squeaks, noises and vibrations (even bad ones like yours), etc. are all justified issues on new Porsches covered under warranty, no doubt. However, Porsche does not pay the normal labor rate to techs to find these things and resolve them during the warranty period. Therefore, they are always wiggling out of working diligently to find your problem. Moreover, if the fix for the issue does not include replacing any parts, the dealership makes no money on the service work. On another note, Hans told me that if the book rate for a repair is 4 hours and it's warranty, Porsche will only pay 60% of book rate to him to fix it. However, if it's customer-paid work, you get charged all four hours, even if he does the job in 2.75 hours, which he typically can do because working longer doesn't pay him any more. Imagine sitting in a waiting room for your car, working on your laptop, which I've done three times now. The service guy quotes 4 hours, the mechanic is done with it in 3 or less hours, but leaves the car on the lift, goes to lunch works on another car, cleans his tools, tells a buddy a joke, and all of this just to make you feel like you paid for 4 hours labor. I know this is how all dealerships work, but it pisses me off. It's cheating the customer in a big way. All this to say, mach, know you're going into warranty issues with people who don't feel they are paid enough to do the work you paid for when you bought your very expensive German car. |
Randall - I know that getting down to the bottom of this vibration problem is not going to be easy (but, who knows, maybe the big overseer of all that happens on this planet will throw another pigeon into demise - like into the mechanics head - and a mild concussion will spark the otherwise lowly motivated porsche mechanic to actually discover something...). However, this is a matter that i will pursue to great lengths. i figure, if anything, the dealer will get tired of paying for my loaner car, since they will have my car often if the vibration is not fixed, that they will begin actually searching for the culprit.
on the other hand, if i fail with them, perhaps i'll try an independent certified porsche mechanic - see what he finds - and then take that info back to porsche. - only thing is, i can't justify at all, having to pay out of my pocket for warranty issues - that's why i bought a new car and not a used one. need to find out if i the cost of seeing an independent cert mech will be reimbursed by porsche (yeah, right!) i've had my vw beetle for over 3 years - have over $5000 in modifications to it - driven it across the country once - and have only had to take it in for a warranty issue, 1 time. it has always started and always gotten me to where i want to go. sure it has some little rattles here and there - but hell it's a less than $20k car - i'll forgive that. maybe i'm being more picky with the porsche - but i think that is justified. i really wonder now, would i have made a better choice either buying a G35 or 350Z (thereby avoiding quality/mechanical issues) or should i have opted for a used 911 or m3 (as were my original intentions - decided against, thinking that warranty and mechanical issues would be avoided with a new German car), since it looks like i'll be dealing with this problem anyway? the final thought, as painful as it will be to follow through (ya know, like the wounded little kid who has been bragging and bragging about how good his hero is, only to have to admit that maybe his hero is not that above average...) is that i let the car go and maybe take up the porsche dream a little later in the medical career when i have more disposable income to throw to such "common" issues that are perhaps part of owning such 'fine' german metal! i hate to sound like a fair weather porsche owner, but it really is hard to have feelings of excitement (and security) in a car that you constantly doubt its integrity! alas, i yearn for the lazy hours of the weekend, yet yearn for monday to arrive, as the future may reveal ones fate... |
Mach Schnell....
When I drove an '06' S last fall --a car with 10 miles on it-- it had a vibration that went the length of the car and felt like it was on the centerline of the car. At a particular rpm (2000-3000) the car really shook. I'm not sure what is was but it was startling.It was the type of vibration that I had never experienced on a Boxster before--986 or 987.
Had it happened on the car that we bought, we would not have taken delivery until it was fixed. Keep us apprised of how Porsche deals with the problem. |
You didn't say anything about whether it happens at specific speeds, but I had a similar problem in the high 60's to 80mph range and it turned out that one of the wheels was way out of balance. I have the adhesive weights and at least one had fallen off. A rebalance solved it.
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box is in today - leading theory (at least when I dropped it off) was an out of balance wheel - hoping that Occam's razor applies here as i don't want it to be something major! Vibration or shaking through-out car is totally speed related - notice at about 65 - obvious above 70 and you want to pull the car over, get out and :barf: above 80!
on a side note - picked up a nice C class sport as my loaner - this could make a new car for my wife (she needs to learn how to take care of the car she has, first :rolleyes: ). Even though there are a ton of these on the roads here in soCal, i really like it better than the 3 series bmw. turns out, though, that although the loaner car is free the first day, I get charged starting the 2nd day - something like $37/day. i really don't think i should have to pay for a car (that's what i did when i bought the porsche!) to drive when my car is in the shop for warrantable service. i'm in the wrong business - maybe doc's should be able to just bill people for walking by the hospital :rolleyes: |
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And I have yet to see the bill for the doctor, who will surely bill me for walking past my room when I was taking a leak in the bathroom. BTW - no heart problems... as I suspected. |
What I have done in the past: Take the service writer for a ride. Make a mental note of where the car had the issue last as you drive towards the dealer. Take the service writer back to that same spot and duplicate the problem for him. 99% of all the dealers have a routine "path" that they follow on all test drives. This "path" may or may not duplicate your problem.
Oh.. ask them to TAPE all the weights on. It is is the ONLY way to gurantee they wont come off. It is very easy for a "grunt/tech" to bang the inside of the wheel on the caliper as they try to mount up your 30+lb 19inch wheel/tire combo thus possibly loosening the weight they just installed (or did a brake inspection).. The possibilities are limitless on how easy it is to knock a weight off. B |
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