Replacing water pump this weekend
 

Don't want to start a war or debate , just want to know what you guys use for anti freeze/ coolant. I am not sure I am buying in on The porsche magic elixir coolant theory...

Have done lots of searches on different forums.. I see lots of charts, graphs and chemistry classes.. None of it seems to agree....

Would call my local dealer, but don't trust em- they quoted me 9.5 hrs labor to change the water pump..... I.m doing it myself...

What are your thoughts?

Pup

When I changed my water pump last year, it had orange extended life antifreeze in it.
After flushing out the system I refilled with Porsche OEM coolant.
Some people use OEM antifreeze, some use regular brands. Your car, your wallet, your choice.
Most will agree that you should not mix OEM with aftermarket brands, so make sure you flush it all out before refilling.

Replace Water Pump

Porsche says drain the lifetime coolant they put in the car into a clean container and reuse it.

Porsche coolant.

I had no idea what was in the car when I started, so I had to flush. Without a lift, what a royal PITA.

I'm doing the same thing myself this weekend. I will also be replacing the thermostat with an LN Enginnering low temperature model. Like you, I've researched it all. Until my eyes bleed. What it comes down to is:

A) Porsche uses OAT longlife antifreeze.

B) You can pretty much mix any Prestone antifreeze without the "gelling" effect. Or use Peak long life antifreeze. Or VM/AUdi. Or Mercedes. Etc.

C) If you don't use Porsche antifreeze and take it to a dealer for any cooling system work, well you are on your own at that point. Too many potential dealer/mechanic issues to bother discussiong but you can probably guess what Porsche will say.

D) It's your money, but how much will you save using non-Porsche antifreeze? And is it worth it? The only reason, and I mean the only "real reason I could find" to use non-Porsche antifreeze seems to be related to availability. If you have a problem while on the road, the regular brands will be highly available. Not so with Porsche brand antifreeze.

For myself, I've decided to buy the Porsche antifreeze and distilled water for the same reason I decided to buy the Porsche water pump - best recommendation from other Porsche owners and saving $75 on antifreeze just isn't woth it to me. You may have another opinon though on how much $75 is value wise than I do.

In any case, best of luck with your install.

FWIW, I picked up 3 Gal of Porsche anti-freeze for $42 a Gal. $10 less than that on the Pelican web site and didn't have to pay for S&H.

Did this last fall (WP, coolant, serpt. belt, thermo, and gaskets). Used OEM Porsche coolant purchased from Sunset. About $23/gallon. And distilled water. You need about 3 gallons of each.

Thanks guys...

I will let you know how it goes...

I will most likely reuse what I remove and top off as needed... I want to see what the color of the stuff is that's in there now... If it is truly the Porsche lifetime magical coolant, I will re-use it and top off...

we'll see

bc

For those that have done this themselves, what was the approximate parts cost?

I just had mine done (pump, belt, flush&fill) and it cost $1038 :eek: at an indy shop.

I paid about $350 for the water pump, tank cap, & shipping from Suncoast Parts. I paid an additional $150 in coolant from my dealer and distilled water. So about $500 in total. Unless you count my LN Engineering low temperature thermostat. That was an additional $75 from a forum member.

Hmmm... I bought a duralast pump (made in Spain) from aut zone that is claimed as OE quality for $153.00 and a Porsche OEM gaslit for $14.00. I bit the bullet and shelled out $94.00 for the coolant vacuum filler tool (no need to bleed the system if filled this way and it verifies the system is water tight). So I'm at $261 plus a Saturday morning...

Edit: I had 4 gallons of Motul antifreeze on hand, I don't remember the cost. Distiller water was about $4.00.

That's a fair price for an indy for all OEM parts & labor.

Pump is $250ish
Coolant is now $35/gallon (3)
Belt is about $36
2 Gaskets are about $14
Thermo is about $40

So, about $445 in parts.

$1,038 - $445 = $593 in labor at $125/hour = 4.75 hours.

I think that's very fair. You did fine. If they do quality work, and I assume they did.

Nearly five hours in labour to change the pump? Are you joking?

I've changed the pump on my car. It didn't take five hours doing it first time and taking it very, very slowly and carefully. An experienced specialist should be able to do it in a fraction of five hours.

Relax dude. Re-read the guys post. He clearly states; pump, belt and flush & fill. I'd bet he paid more in parts and less in labor than my estimate.

shadrach74,
does the pump have a composite or metal impeller?

Wait.. if you mix say Prestone with the Porsche oem coolant it will cause "gelling"?

It's metal... I'm not trying to start a debate here, but I was actually happy that it was metal. I've been left stranded twice (not in Pcars) by plastic pump impellers that cracked into pie shapes. The worst that's happened with a metal pump is a minor leak. So I'm fine with trying one this time around. for what it's worth, this pump came with a limited lifetime warranty, which was better than any of the other pumps I looked at...

Not according to Prestone. They state it is compatible with any antifreeze. From what I read, the problem was based on older antifreezes with high concentrations of silicates. Not used in lifetime (current) antifreeze. However, as always, you spend your money you take your chances. Its also wjy I decided to use OEM coolant after a through flush. I'm not sure what is in my P-car as of now.

Firstly, you have to remove and replace the belt to do the pump and you'll have the panel off anyway, so that adds no time at all. Same re the the fluid, really - you'll be draining most of it, anyway, taking the the pump off.

I was including pump, belt and flush in my consideration. They're pretty much all part of the pump-changing process. Five hours for an experienced professional with a lift and the correct tools is far too much. Being generous, I would say an hour to an hour and a half to remove and replace pump and then another hour and a half to flush, fill and bleed.

I suppose in reality you'd be lucky to charged less than four hours for the job. But that's why I try to avoid using shops. You rarely get charged for how long jobs really ought to take.

The breakdown of charges from the Indy shop:

Pump=$324 (ouch!)
Gasket=$16
Coolant=$60
Belt=$56
Shop supplies (water?)=$28
Labor: 5 hrs@$105/hr=$525
Tax=$29

I've done a lot of work on my other cars, but the pump failed at work so I flat bedded it to the nearest shop.

Water pump done, new belt installed and oil change completed. 3.5 hrs. My sone did it.. He is Master Certifed ASE mechanic.. When changing water pump only drained about 1.5 gallons of coolant. Added it back , ran motor and heater till hot, opened vent added 1/2 gallon of distiller water to top it off...

Pump had some play, belt was ready to break, idles were all good.. Top one could be replaced but didn't have one on hand... And the bolt is soo long, sheesh, thought the rear bumper was on the end of it... How to you get that bolt out anyway, it hits the inner wall???

Anyway, Lots quieter now, popped the new glass windowed top and went for a nice ride in the lakes region.. Almost 65 degrees today.

Perfect!

Pup

True dat. But, an indy, a good & fair one, will be much-much closer to actual time than some "book time". that the dealerships use. In my experience.

I have very little free time, even if I had the skills (which I don't) to do this DIY. I'd rather take a 4-5 hour drive through my favorite country roads (which I do).

Good job, Pup. Keep an eye on the coolant level the new few drives. In the morning, when she's cold, top off as necessary, until the level stabilizes. It may take a cup here, a cup there.

Remember a shop has to account for ALL time involved. That includes drop off/pickup of the car, paperwork, ordering parts, jockeying cars around, etc. Actual "wrench time" is only a portion of the job.

Surely any drop-off and pickup are separate charges, not rolled into the labour charge?

Paperwork should not be part of the charge. When you buy an hour of someone's time, that doesn't include them invoicing you. If they're even remotely efficient at ordering parts, it will add but a few minutes. Same goes for moving cars around.

Moreover, moving cars around is their problem, not yours as a customer. What next? Charge you labour hours for the time is takes to clean up the shop at the end of the day? Charge you for their travel costs home at the end of the day?

I know it's not easy to make money and there are large overheads running a shop. But in my experience standard practice is to exaggerate the hours involved pretty dramatically and I don't like that.

Would far prefer they were all more honest and quoted a higher hourly rate.

Fortunately, if you hunt around you will find one or two who do bill just for what they do.