Is this a good price on an S?
 

I'm new to Boxsters and this will be my first purchase. Found a dealer-for sale 2002 Boxster S black on black with 18" wheels premium chrome wheels, sports package with 26,700 miles going for $24,325. Talked the dealer down to $20,600. My question: is this a good deal? I'm already over budget after taxes and I'm trying to get the best deal, but I'm getting emotionally attached to the car now. Test drove it and everything is like new. My original budget was 19K, but am I being realistic about a 2001-2003 S with low miles for that price.

Advice please as it is on hold for me until this weekend.

Thanks

Scott

I can't speak for Maryland but to me that is a little too high. Unless, of course, it comes with warranty/CPO. You can pick them up in California for far less than that, or even here.

It is fairly expensive, even in great condition. I'd try and get another few k off that.

The 2002 (and 1/2) Boxster S had the Xenon headlights as standard equipment (earlier 2002's did not). PSM is a nice option.

With both of those options, windscreens, newer tires and proof of proper service history I would be looking to spend in the high teens...But, your really not that far off so your getting an OK deal.

Also, get it inspected before you buy. The Boxster can be a reliable car, but it has some known weak spots. Get someone who knows what to look for evaluate your purchase.






Sounds like your buying it...





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That doesn't seem far from being a good price. It has really nice low mileage. Get a PPI (pre-purschage inspection) and see if it needs any work, that might help with price negotiations. I know in Charlotte last fall when I got my 2000 'S' if there had been a 2002 'S' for less then $20k with low mileage it would have sold pretty fast.

Let them know you had a budget and set amount...then wait a couple days and they'll probably call you.

Those wheels look like a nice upgrade

So you think something might be wrong with it?

Forgot to mention it has a carfax on it and had 4 owners with a good history of service—for what there was with 26k on it. Was originally a corporate car with 2k a year on it. The other 3 owners ranged 4-6k on it between them. Do I need to do an independent PPI since its a dealer sale? It's a well known dealer in PA. Both KKB listed it around 26k and Nada at 20K.

I originally offered $19,000 on it but only got them to $20,600. Not sure if they are going to go any lower (from $22,000). I haven't seen any dealer or private under 30k mileage on a 02-03 S going for under $18,000 around the east coast.

At the dealers current price, I'll be paying $22,000 after all is done (taxes, etc.)—$3,000 over my budget—I'm open to anymore advice. Pass because there will be another close to this one or bit the bullet.

Sorry for my ignorance—what is PSM?



I'm trying not to make an emotional purchase—but common sense is leaning to yes.

Don't think anything is wrong, but from all the listening and reading I have done getting a PPI from an Indy makes sense. I wish I had but I also go lucky and got a good car.

How long have you been looking? If this one doesn't work out there will be others. Have you watched the 'Classifieds' on this forum for a while. Members offer great prices and almost all the time they are well cared for cars that you can't`` go wrong buying. Some even have the RMS/IMS/Clutch all fixed. I'd even pay extra in many cases for a car from another forum member. Not saying they are all perfect but some really nice ones pass through.

How much will you drive the car. If you don't mind going between 45 and 65k miles you can save a lot...and if you won't be driving it a ton it will still have decent mileage in a few years.

With low mileage and 4 owners that isn't a bad thing, a lot of these cars sit in folks garages most of the time.

PSM Porsche Stability Management

Will help keep the rear from overtaking the front when cornering fast, among other things.

If the car is in as nice of shape as it looks with those options discussed, it is a "fair"price...may not be the lowest price but it is fair. See what the PPI says.... Bob

What kind of wheels are that? They look amazing!

I believe the wheels are Porsche Sport Classic II that are chromed. They actually weren't my first choice (not into chrome wheels—pain to keep clean), but since they are on the car they are growing on me.

I've been looking for about 4 months now Autotrader, Craigslist and this forum. Saw a few deals come and go on a few S's on this forum and dealers on the east coast. If it doesn't sound like a gotta-have it price on this one then I'm going to push for another $1,500 off and see what they say—then walk away. I just hate not knowing if I'll spend more in the future for what this one has.

The dealership is a big flagship Mazda dealership and being 150 mile away from me might be difficult to arrange a PPI since I don't know that area and Porsche certified garages. This is why I asked about getting a PPI done—not about the extra cost but logistics. Plus I thought the dealer would have to have one completed or some type of multi-inspection done. They do offer a 3 month warranty on the vehicle.

I would take an 2002-030S black or red, manual with under 50k from anyone on this forum for $18,000 but I haven't seen those prices either. What I have found are more expensive prices on the forums, but they should be since everyone is an enthusiast and want a premium on their babies—I understand that.

Seems like for what I ultimately want will be in the 20k range.

Thanks. I will ask about that.

By the way, if you are interested. I am a PPI-Pre Purchase Inspector in the Maryland area.

I go to Bethesda, Baltimore, Hagerstown, Rockville, SilverSpring, and other areas including D.C., Fairfax, VA, Tysons Corner.

PM me if you are interested. I also have a Boxster myself so I know what to look for.

As for the price. It is a little high.

I know someone getting a 2004 Boxster with 25,000 miles for the same price. It is not an S though.

I don't think they are Porsche Sport Classic II. They look like "non-Porsche" after market wheels.

They are Porsche Sport Classic II. I asked and take a look. They are just the chrome 18" version.

Thanks, I will definitely contact you if this or another purchase goes forward.

Have you ever owned a black car? :D
Not the best choice for a daily driver if that's your intent. Man every little scratch and chip that is inevitable just becomes magnified. Now toss in chrome wheels, probably the most labor-intensive to keep looking purty. And that black interior that picks up every little piece of lint. You'll spend 3 hours buffing and cleaning and its dirty by the end of the day. As they say everyone owns a black car once.

Upgrading those lights is very expensive. I paid $1400 aout 6 years ago in a group buy with a Porsche dealership when the Euro was still soft. They probably go for closer to $2,000 now. But before even doing that I would upgrade the IMS bearing to the unit from the forum sponsor Flat6 innovations. Any Porsche spcialist can do the job in a day. Along with the clutch and upgrading to the Cayenne RMS seal you'll be looking at $2,000. I'm guessing the dealer probably changed the oil, if he didn't and if you get the car inspected get the mechanic to cut open the oil filter abd roll it out to check for IMS seal fragments. If they're cracked peppercorn size or bigger you'll have some negotiating room because that means there's a great likelyhood that the RMS seal is disintegrating and could go at any momment. Kaboom new engine. And of course don't bring this up ahead of time because the dealer might go and get the oil changed before you arrive and claim the old filter was tossed. Either way the IMS should be the first thing you change, personally I wouldn't evend drive it before fixing that. In general you want to point out every possible repair because its more leverage for you.

As far as price, I'm the biggest ball buster I know. But this car might make a little less aggressive. The color is a definite negotiation point in your favor. If there are no service records for the oil changes that's a big minus for them. at barely 2K miles a year that could be a big problem if the car's oil sat idle for a long time (weeks or months) or if the car wasn't driven frequently, even for at least a local 10 mile spin around town. I'd try and reach the previous owner to see what his driving patterns were like. If this car sat still for weeks at a time over the last 10 years there could be a whole bunch of isssue that won't become visible until you start cranking up the avearga miles per drive in a big way. A definite plus for you as far as bargaining power. Low mileage means nothing if you don't know how often the car was taken out of the garage or if the oil was changed regularly regardless of mileage. Without that knowledge they're basically waiting for a buyer who knows little to concede that the low mileage is a plus for the dealer's asking price. And of course those headlights are very dated now. Actually they were dated for 2002 because the next year Litronics were standard. Without the service records its hard to say what this car is worth and what potential issues there may be. In general the more frequently the oil was operating at temperature at least 3,000 RPM the better the drivetrain's life expectancy.

By the way.

What would be a reasonable price on a drivetrain warranty (to cover any IMS/RMS issue)?

I was quoted:


a 36 month/36000 mile warranty is 2268
a 48 month/ 60000 mile warranty is 3357

I asked if would be lower if I fiance the car through them, but they aren't budging on that or the price of $20,600. So it will be closer to 26k out the door with warranty and taxes, etc.

With my budget of 19k I guess I'm asking for to much?

Those wheels have a good size lip. Has anyone ever seen 18" Porsche Sport Classic II's with a lip like that? Maybe they don't know, is it a Porsche dealership?

Ask them to take a picture of the option sticker under the front trunk, then you'll at least know what it had from the factory.

IMHO, those wheels would have to go. Way too much bling for my tastes. Of course, I'm not looking to buy it, so...

Those wheels would be great if they weren't chrome (for my taste), if they really are 18". I would like to know who makes them.

PSM = Porsche Stability Management aka Please Save Me

The most common mistake people make when purchasing a car is letting emotion rule.

Some take it or leave it advice:

Whenever I am contemplating a purchase, whether it be clothes, cars, tools (that I think I really gotta have), electronic gear or gadgets, and emotion kicks in, I automatically wait 1 week before making the purchase.

Sometimes the desire is still strong, so I make the buy and am generally satisfied. Sometimes my passion for the item fades and I am glad I didn't buy it on 1st impulse.

Other times, I have often found one that is better, one that I like more, or the same item at a lower price.

In a few rare cases, the original item is no longer available a week later, which I just write up to fate - it wasn't to be.

This practice has served me well over the years and prevented me from spending money needlessly on things I really don't want or need.

It takes some practice, especially with a used car with the potential to be 'lost' to someone else.

On the other hand, if you disappear for a week, the dealer or seller is more prone to haggle when you return because he knows that you're both a serious, and non-emotional buyer. His tricks (yes... they do use tricks to play on your emotions) don't work and he knows it. If he wants to make the sale, he has to play it straight up.

And maybe the most important thing to keep in mind is:

The one thing the World has no shortage of is used Boxsters!

Don't exceed a tight budget, it will diminish your joy in the car and have you 2nd guessing yourself.

Good Luck!

Another thing to realize about these cars is that their value is still plumetting.

If financing the car, consider how you're going to feel a year later when the car's market value is $17k, but you still owe the bank $22k.

I'd say stay within your budget! You can still find a very nice Boxster and get out the door for $19k.

It won't be the newest model, or the most option loaded, it might not even seem as nice as the one you're looking at here. If your budget is truly realistic, you have to face the fact that you cannot afford this car.

But you're not in a position to go to the showroom and get the exact car you want either, so you have to make some compromise.

Cheers!

Those wheels look like the same ones I have in black. Cheap ebay ones. They look nice but are heavy

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/19-Porsche-Cayman-Boxster-997-911-CHROME-wheels-rims-/230662153128?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories &hash=item35b48923a8

Yes, I question whether they really are 18" and not 19".

I purchased my 2000S two years back and paid $15,700 plus tax. Mine was a one owner with 62K on the clock. It is completely stock and that is how I will keep it. I have put about $1800 in it, like new tires, rotors & pads, brake flush, filters, oil change and servicing the Tip. Love the car. :cheers:

OH, I just had a new GAAH top installed at a cost of $1450.00

Thanks everyone for all the advice (my wife thanks you too!).
I decided to pass on this particular boxster as it was out of my budget. After driving it, I let my emotions get the better of my decision making. I'm going to take my time and find the right boxster that fits my budget—and re-evalute what I will be doing with the vehicle once I get it.

I want a weekend driver that I can slowly personalize to my needs and tastes.

Scott, There will be people getting rid of their "summer" cars soon. Keep you'd eyes open on craisglist and ebay for cities around you that you can drive/fly to and get a good deal.

Here ya go..

http://www.deter.com/porsche/PSM.txt