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-   -   Engine air intake - why did Porsche do this? (http://986forum.com/forums/performance-technical-chat/32302-engine-air-intake-why-did-porsche-do.html)

Kroggers 12-19-2011 11:24 AM

Engine air intake - why did Porsche do this?
 
It is very possible that I am missing some really smart engineering by Porsche here, so I am sorry if this is obvious and I am missing the point :confused:

Whilst working on the air intake on my racing car I was aligning up the factory grill minus some bars to get a feel for how the air flow is moving into the filter - and I am really confused by what I see.

This can not be good for air flow? Include to this the fact that the bottom two grill bars are solid. the air can only enter from the top half of the grill and then it is directed into the side corner before winding it's way down to the entry to the air box.

What am I missing with this design???

http://986forum.com/forums/uploads01...1324326264.jpg

ProjectM96 12-19-2011 11:39 AM

You are right about that. The only explanation is that this is Porsche's way of making it much less powerful than the Porsche 911 so that it does not compete with it.

Meir 12-19-2011 12:32 PM

read this
 
http://www.renntech.org/forums/tutorials/article/141-desnorkle-your-986/

as far is i understand, the snorkle was added to US cars in order to stand with noise regulation.
the engine will be more noisy with out it and it sound great. just removed it yesterday from my car.:dance:

thstone 12-19-2011 01:12 PM

There are several issues to consider regarding the Boxster intake design:

1. Foreign particle ingestion - design should allow large particles/items (dirt, pebbles, leaves, cig butts, etc) drawn into the air intake to "fall out" of the air flow prior to the air filter
2. Water ingestion -- design should allow any water drawn into the air intake to "fall out" of the air flow prior to the air filter (including driving in heavy rainfall, carwash jets, solid splash of water from car in next lane, etc)
3. Intake noise - if needed, help meet overall noise standards
4. Performance - meet engine performance standards
5. Cost - meet (or be less than) the cost goal
6. Packaging (space limitations) - fit into the allocated space
7. Ease of assembly - easy to assemble in the factory
8. Maintainability - does not require periodic maintenance
9. Durability - long lasting
10. Repairability - easy to remove and replace

Based on all of these (and many more) criteria, the Porshe engineers came up with the design as implemented and as such, it is sure to be a compromise between performance and the other criteria.

Kroggers 12-19-2011 07:32 PM

OK, so bottom line, this is a compromise made by Porsche to ensure reliability etc and the cost of performance.

As this is a racing car, I would therefore do better to alter the design to allow for a straight line for the air to get to the filter - is this correct or am I still missing something?

thstone 12-19-2011 07:56 PM

You are correct in the straighter and smoother the airflow, the better! :cheers:

All I was trying to say is that the Porsche engineers had to take a lot more into consideration than just performance. I'm not saying that they came up with a perfect compromise or even a clever one, just saying that there is alot of of often conflicting goals to try to meet in a single design.

blue2000s 12-19-2011 08:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kroggers (Post 269506)
It is very possible that I am missing some really smart engineering by Porsche here, so I am sorry if this is obvious and I am missing the point :confused:

Whilst working on the air intake on my racing car I was aligning up the factory grill minus some bars to get a feel for how the air flow is moving into the filter - and I am really confused by what I see.

This can not be good for air flow? Include to this the fact that the bottom two grill bars are solid. the air can only enter from the top half of the grill and then it is directed into the side corner before winding it's way down to the entry to the air box.

What am I missing with this design???

http://986forum.com/forums/uploads01...1324326264.jpg

Something doesn't look right in that picture. Are you trying to use a 987 intake?

Topless 12-19-2011 09:11 PM

Water and foreign object ingestion was a problem on first generation Boxsters. If you are building a race car and never plan to run it in the rain, why not mount a roof intake scoop and a nice large flexible intake duct directly to your air filter box, GT-1 style:
Carbon Creations Carbon Creations Universal Hood Roof Scoop 1 - 102894

Kroggers 12-19-2011 09:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Topless (Post 269579)
Water and foreign object ingestion was a problem on first generation Boxsters. If you are building a race car and never plan to run it in the rain, why not mount a roof intake scoop and a nice large flexible intake duct directly to your air filter box, GT-1 style:
Carbon Creations Carbon Creations Universal Hood Roof Scoop 1 - 102894

Yes, it is a dedicated racing car, but we do have some wet racing as well - can not plan every race to be in the sun :)

The filter location in my 911 and the motorbike is more open than on the Boxster and I have never had problems with rain whilst driving. I will assume water getting to the filter is more of a problem when the engine is not running...

The scoop idea has been considered and an interesting option, but our class regulations does not permit any "new" holes to be put into the firewall or covers that separate the engine from the driver.

Quote:

Originally Posted by blue2000s (Post 269572)
Something doesn't look right in that picture. Are you trying to use a 987 intake?

Sorry to say, but that is the factory design. You are looking at the grill section from the 986 air intake scoop mounted against the side of my 986 racing car.

The only thing that is not as factory is the fact that I have removed the air box, so the normal snorkel thing is not in the picture.

jaykay 12-20-2011 06:43 AM

Interestingly enough I once had paper numbers taped to my doors for a track weekend.
It rained for most of it. Eventually the paper desinigrated with bits and pieces streaming all along along the sides of the car. There was bits stuck to the intake scoop. I pulled the air filter and it was clean nothing made it through.

On another occasion I have found seeds in there

I am desnorkled

lifeisgood 12-21-2011 11:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kroggers (Post 269506)
It is very possible that I am missing some really smart engineering by Porsche here, so I am sorry if this is obvious and I am missing the point :confused:

Whilst working on the air intake on my racing car I was aligning up the factory grill minus some bars to get a feel for how the air flow is moving into the filter - and I am really confused by what I see.

This can not be good for air flow? Include to this the fact that the bottom two grill bars are solid. the air can only enter from the top half of the grill and then it is directed into the side corner before winding it's way down to the entry to the air box.

What am I missing with this design???

http://986forum.com/forums/uploads01...1324326264.jpg

Quote:

Originally Posted by blue2000s (Post 269572)
Something doesn't look right in that picture. Are you trying to use a 987 intake?


Is that fire flames on the side of the car? Cool.

Kroggers 12-21-2011 07:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lifeisgood (Post 269890)
Is that fire flames on the side of the car? Cool.

Nope, it is the racing team logo :)

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1304014049.jpg

http://coolcavaracing.eu/CoolCavaLogo.gif

Steve Tinker 12-21-2011 08:56 PM

Now that what I call a lowered Boxster - hell, you can hardly see the top of the wheels let alone the tyres.......
I bet the turning circle is - er - somewhat restricted !!

Kroggers 12-21-2011 09:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steve Tinker (Post 269965)
Now that what I call a lowered Boxster - hell, you can hardly see the top of the wheels let alone the tyres.......
I bet the turning circle is - er - somewhat restricted !!

No, there is no problem with the turning circle. Did have some rubbing on the rear at the start of the 2011 season, but fixed that after the first race with a grinder :)

Remember this is a dedicated racing car, so the suspension is rather stiff and the geometry set-up for track use - I would not want this configuration on a street car!

LAP1DOUG 12-22-2011 03:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kroggers (Post 269967)
No, there is no problem with the turning circle. Did have some rubbing on the rear at the start of the 2011 season, but fixed that after the first race with a grinder :)

Remember this is a dedicated racing car, so the suspension is rather stiff and the geometry set-up for track use - I would not want this configuration on a street car!

Wow, with that low rear end, I would guess the lower control arm is past horizontal such that the rear roll center is "below ground", thus increasing the rear roll couple, or have you relocated the lower control arm pivot points?

Anyway, regarding de-snorkling, it looks like a good idea to me for a race car, and I think I'm going to do that on my part-time race car that is almost never driven in rain anyway.

Good luck...


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