NO Start issue after Engine swap, HELP!
 

OK this will be some what lengthy inquiry.

I acquired a 2002 Boxster S with inter mix issue with 87K miles. Replaced the engine with a 2003 model Boxster S with 78K. The donor engine came from a automatic car. Following the Pelican Engine swap advice. Looks like I need to upgrade my ECU to 7.8 from 7.2. I got one from Ebay.

Also I have to source a manual wiring harness from a 2.7 Manual 2002 model. Only modification I did to the wiring is the transmission back up light connector from 5 speed to 6 speed. Wondering why I did not use the old one is because I want to keep the old engine intact complete for resale.

Now mostly got the car together and me and my son trying to start it and the response is not even a crank, dash are all lid up and engine failure appears on the dash. Atempted to hook OBD2 to view error code and failed to connect. Tried two different code reader and both failed to connect. All fuses are good and battery is over 12 volts, no help from battery charger in start mode.

I need idea what can cause this mode on Boxster, looks like security related?

Thanks in advance.
XR

the security system consists of 3 parts that needs to match each other.
the emobilizer. located next to the ignition switch.
the alarm system located under the driver seat.
and the ECU located in the trunk.
all 3 of them need to talk with each other. if you replaced the ECU, you need to program it to accept the other 2 units.
with that said, i do not think that an issue with the security system will cause the engine not to crank. i will let more experience forum member make their comments, but meanwhile start with the simple stuff.
override the clutch switch, just to take it out of the equeison.

As you were informed on another website, you are using the car's original keys with a new DME, which has the codes from the 3.2 car's keys programed into it, and the car will not start. So either install the ignition and keys from the 3.2 car, or flat bed the car to a dealer, and get ready to spend money for new keys, and programming.

Hi Meir,

Thanks for your quick response, I will override the clutch switch just to make sure.

Ohhh additional information, so after we found we have no crank start and thinking the new computer not talking to the existing system we went to install the old computer and the same behavior from the car, also no OBD2 communication, crap!

I’m still puzzle why my OBD2 not connecting, this is some what unexpected. I was hoping that port will provide me with the error code I can start addressing issues.

I need OBD2 get sorted out first.

Thanks,
XR

Hi JFP,

My key is currently battery dead, I’m not getting the flashing red light during the locking and unlocking.

I will buy a new key battery today and try it on my old ECU, I’m thinking I should be able to start my car using the old ECU. The car may not run right but it should start.

Thanks,
XR

New Key battery did not help, still flashing red light on my key.

Have you checked your fuses?

Just a note: The battery in the key has NOTHING to do with starting the car. The parts of the key that effect starting the car are the blade (to turn the lock for the ignition switch) and the transponder (to send the correct code to the immobilizer)
Here's a pic of the transponder:
http://986forum.com/forums/uploads02/key1526073692.jpg
That's the only thing needed inside the key to have the car start. No battery, or electronics.

Make sure that all of the original 2002 elements are in place: Key with transponder, immobilizer box, and DME (ECU).

Ground not correct? Big ground wire in the engine compartment. Bundle of brown wires in the trunk by the DME (ECU), brown wire that bolts to the floor by the immobilizer box under the seat.

Is the starter known good?

Is there more to the story? Could the car crank before you started on the engine swap...?

Will a 2002 DME (7.2) start a 2003 (7.8) engine ???

If not, then you'll have to get the 2002 transponder and immobilizer reprogrammed to match the 2003 DME.

Not a whole lot to add other than my cheap OBD reader will not communicate with my 2000S unless I start the car, which of course, you can't do. The OBD reader had similar issue on a BMW we owned but would work just fine with our 350Z and 4Runners
.

Yes we have, all of them are good.

2002 versus 2003 differences:

Wiring harness
Software

I'd not be surprised if that's the problem.

Hi 78F350,

Thanks for your reply, yes I saw the little pill inside the key, then I realized that was a transponder of sort.

The car ran before the swap, off course using the old engine. I was expecting when I returned the old ECU will resolve any security.

Thanks,
XR

OK latest work and still no crank or start. Also OBD2 not communicating.

• New battery
• Check fuel pressure bypass relay, good pressure
• Check clutch switch
• Reconnect immobilizer module
• Disconnect radio fuse, maybe K & L lines interfering with after market radio

Currently the car top partially open or some people called service mode.

I’m starting to believed my key pill could be bad?

I still need to bypass the starter relay to temporarily crank the car to make sure that connection is good, what’s the best way?

Thanks,
XR

ok, so perhaps you didn't follow the pelican advise completely? they state that you have to modify the dme pinouts slightly; it appears you only modified for the difference in transmission (was the new ecu for a manual or a tip, as that needs to be coded in as well if i recall correctly). you might find that some pins have to be moved around. i suggest you get the dme schematic/pinouts for both a 2002 and a 2003, make an excel spreadsheet and compare the two. go on ebay and get a set of pin removal tools from china for $1.99 and move what you have to move. i'm thinking some of the CANbus wires have moved, and perhaps the k-line (obd signal).

Following the Pelican engine swap instruction the two 7.8 Motronic from 02 996 and 07 Cayman wiring are still different from each other, since i have a 2002 S body with 2003 S engine which 7.8 should i follow?

Donor Engine 2003 S Auto
Donor Wiring 2003 2.7 Manual
Donor ECU Module 996.618.604.00 (i think its for 7.8)

I have xls sheet that i'm putting together, need more detail to complete

Thanks,
XR

at this point, perhaps just confirm that the dme has power and see if you can pull an obd signal direct from the unit. here's what i have for 2002 pinouts for that connector:

Connector I, 9-pole
Pin Designation Pin Designation
1 Terminal 15 - switched power
2 Terminal 30 - always on power
3 W-wire - OBD
4 Ground, electronics
5 Ground, fuel injectors
6 Ground, output stages
7 Throttle motor actuator
8 DME relay terminal 87 - pretty sure this is permission from immobiliser to turn on
9 Throttle motor actuator

King,

Looks like base on the internet information 7.2 DME should have below

Connector 1
1.Terminal 15
2.Not used
3.W-wire
4.GND Electronic
5.GND Injections
6.GND Final Stage
7.Terminal 30
8.TERM.87 MFI-DI
9.Not used

I need to move the female line #7 (Terminal 30) connector 1 to pin #2 to match 7.8 DME.

Not what tool can i use to extract the femal pin from the connector housing?

Thanks,
XR

https://www.ebay.com/itm/11Pcs-Car-Wire-Terminal-Removal-Tool-Wiring-connector-Pin-Extractor-Puller-Tools/382191260228?epid=12012656784&hash=item58fc5fd244: g:MzUAAOSw74VZjHYh

and double check your info; 5v at the wrong place can cause troubles.

I think you'll find that your old engine with the intermix isn't worth much. Did the old engine start and run before all this? I don't know for a fact that your 02 harness will fit on an 03, it would fit on an 00 or an 01, but that's not too relevant.

I guess I'm saying, if it was a running but bad engine, take the harness off the old engine, use the DME that came with it, and see if it will fit the 03. Looks to me like you did a tactical error--an 00 to 02 would have been easy peasy.

Will the engine crank if you bridge the terminals on the starter? Do you have a good strong ground connection from the starter to the chassis? Are all the grounds in the trunk firmly attached to the chassis?

03 has a different cam adjuster. you might ba able to repurpose the harness in some manner, but you need the 7.8 dme.

Wow, why not just source a full ecm, immobilizer, key combo for the engine and trans in your car? Seems like a lot of noodling to little result. Also, why did you need a 2.7 harness for a 3.2 engine? It doesn’t matter what type of car the engine came out of, it just wants gas, spark and air. It is your harness and control systems that need to mate to the engine to give it all of that. Seems like you have a whacky Frankenstein thing going on with your swap...

You sure know a lot of stuff!:cheers:

TRK's point about the "Connector I" was great info. I hadn't even thought about that part of it until he mentioned it. That plug comes from the chassis harness and the DME 7.2 harness will not power the 7.8 until those pins are corrected.

You are on the right path with the wiring. Get the body harness to engine harness wiring correct, then get the OBD communication working. You will then need to get the DME matched to the immobilizer before you can even attempt to start the car. For this, you will either need to take it to a dealer, or find someone with a PST-2 or PIWIS II, etc., and get the programming codes from your car from the dealer. Then the DME and immobilizer can be properly matched. I would NOT recommend getting the immobilizer, DME and key from another car even though it would work, as this can/will lead to other problems down the road as your car would now be electronically whatever car you got the parts (by VIN) as far is Porsche is concerned. That means the programming codes, etc., for your car would no longer be valid. If you would need a key or DME programmed down the road, you would have to have the VIN from the car you got the DME and immobilizer from to get the programming codes to allow the process to work. If you don't have that, it can get complicated and expensive.

Sooo, what did you do about the fuel system? The '03 uses a single line, non-returning fuel system with the regulator on the pump, whereas the '02 uses a returning system with the regulator on the fuel rail. On the one car that I know that was converted from ME 7.2 to 7.8, the fuel system also had to be converted to get to operate properly. There may also be some communication issues with the ABS system and cluster as the ME 7.8 uses more CAN integration than the ME 7.2 cars did. That may not be evident until you get it running. I believe that the '03 also uses different oxygen sensors than the early cars. Did you also get these?

Hi Guys,

I got the a tool from our local autoparts
http://986forum.com/forums/uploads02...1526871463.jpg

I used the small flat tool, the next size was to big. Just insert and push till feel the little snap.

Got Terminal 30 moved from pin #7 to pin #2 of connector 1.

How about the (Throttle VLV MTR +) and (Throttle VLV MTR -), on 7.8 this is located on #7 and #9, currently this two slots are vacant.

King & Qumulus, thank you for your continuous help, i'm new to Porsche

XR

they are located on other connectors on the earlier harness. pm me your email address and i can send to you.

King,

Private email sent.

XR

Qmulus

The fuel line is a single port on the 2002 Boxster S, similarly the 2003 is same. I have no extra fuel return line on the engine. I did not saw a pressure regulator on the 2003 engine itself. I also manually powered up the fuel pump bypassing the relay, the fuel have good pressure. If I missed a fuel return line on either car or engine side I should have fuel leaks? I was surprise no fuel smell of leak detected.

Then again, I’m still learning the Porsche system, my confidence is questionable honestly? I’m winging it as I go, but not reckless.

I think this conversion is more challenging due to the 02 & 03 year of cut off when they started switch between DME 7.2 to 7.8.

Thanks,
XR