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-   -   What you don't want to have happen (http://986forum.com/forums/boxster-general-discussions/62450-what-you-dont-want-have-happen.html)

MWS 07-21-2016 07:47 AM

What you don't want to have happen
 
Here's a story of what you don't want to have happen...

I have a '01 2.7 with approximately 47,500 mi that I have owned for about 10 years. I have had the car stored for 3 years (maybe as little as 1000 mi since '10), and I should mention that the car had no issues when driven last. This spring I decided to start bringing the car back to life and after battery replacement, had multiple electrical gremlins which I resolved with the exception of the climate control, which I narrowed down to the climate control unit. The unit in question was replaced in 2008, so 8 years ago, but almost new. I could have purchased a used unit online and switched my face using the donor board, but since the fault that caused the failure of the board was unknown and fearing burning out another board, I decided (with the advice from this forum) to go the Porsche route and order a new unit and have them install at a cost of about $900.

Now here is where the "might as well" starts to come into play...

Never did the IMS, so I figured if in for $900 plus service I am at about maybe $1200, might as well do the IMS (using LN bearing) at Porsche cost of about $3000. Now estimate is at about $4200, so more "might as wells".... I trust my Porsche rep as we have a history going back over 15 years (we also have Audis), so I asked them to check RMS, AOS, belts etc, and change fuel filter, plugs, bla-bla. Basically, check everything, replace any needed item and keep bill $5000-ish. I also need tires (not too badly worn, just old), but asked them to check, and if needed I would have a set sent to them (they even advise it's cheaper for me to buy and have sent to them rather than buy from them, which is nice).

So yesterday morning I am driving to the dealership (about 60 mi) on a rural road when suddenly a convertible Corvette C7 flies up behind me, then fades way back. We reach a 4 lane road, and the 'vette comes along beside me and starts yelling something. I slow down to hear him, and apparently I am spraying liquid from the rear passenger wheel arch, I am pissed, but thank him to which re replied, "you got it all over my windshield, ****************************"), fine, whatever. I pull over to investigate, to find pink mist (obviously G12 coolant) sprayed from wheel arch. I check level via observation port on tank, shows about 3/4, cap is hot, but dash gauge is in the middle, no high temp light on. I proceed a couple miles to gas station and call service rep, he instructed to let car cool, and check level in tank visually via cap opening, add water if needed and proceed to shop (about 10 mi). When I opened cap, the level I saw on inspection window was a "ghost" and tank was actually empty. I added almost 2 gallons of straight water, some leaking underneath, but didn't just pour out. I proceeded to shop without further problems, but tank was empty at arrival. To clarify, temp on gauge never spiked, no temp light and most importantly, no sound or smell. Here is where I should mention about 900 mi ago I had a catastrophic coolant pump failure, which I had Porsche replace including new lines, total pressure flush (twice for piece of mind), almost a total coolant rebuild short of rads (which were flushed separately) at a total cost of about $2200. The unfortunate part is even thought the coolant system was done only 900 mi ago, it was in 2011.

I am waiting for update from shop.

Anyway, not a good day. Sorry for the length, I guess I wanted to vent to kind people who might understand. Feel free to offer opinions, or heck, laugh at me for throwing money down a hole. I guess I don't see my Boxster as just a machine, but there is some emotional attachment. When it makes me happy, I am very happy; other times (like now), I forgive it and remember... soon you will make me smile again.

MWS 07-21-2016 08:06 AM

Quick update, soon as I hit "post", shop called. Apparently they pressure tested system and ran at temp, they say it is the coolant cap (apparently there have been revisions). I don't know if I accept answer, as when I added water, some poured out immediately underneath; granted, I spilled some, but appeared more leaked than was spilt. Also, my trunk carpet was totally dry.

Is it possible to loose that much coolant via cap within 30 min???

Disaster 07-21-2016 08:14 AM

So in about 1500 miles of driving you put over $7200 into repairs! :-O

It does seem odd that coolant wouldn't have gotten into the trunk if the cap was leaking.

CrisZenithBlue 07-21-2016 08:34 AM

first off.. dont feel bad about the money pit. heck if i would i wouldnt sleep right at night. i got this car for 9k and i'm over 20k in it one year and a half later and just replaced my engine at 130k miles. for me it's all about the happiness it brings me and it brings a lot. as long as i am not taking food from my kids mouths (if i had any :D) i can accept the expenses.

now.. your situation sounds similar to something that happened to me a while back. i was driving my friends Boxster to see what all the fuss is about with this tip tronic stuff and i will admit i was driving fairly hard (good friend this guy :) ). at one point we were stopped at a light and the temp gauge blinker starts to flash indicating low coolant level and steam starts coming out the rear passenger front wheel well. my heart stops for a second (I blew up his car?) and when i walk out and see it's steam not smoke i breathe again. the temp didnt go up at all so i caught it early. we kill the engine push (the heavy bastard!) over to the side of the road and the underside is full of green coolant. i figure it's the water pump.. tank was empty.

my mechanic looks at it and finds out it's the valve behind the water pump which can be deleted. he did that and a few days later another hose cracks and he spills all the fluid again. it's a 2001 model but most of the coolant hoses were old and brittle, the one that popped looked like an over fried sausage.

i'm with you on this one, i dont think it's the coolant cap if you're spilling underneath, it's probably something else, there are a lot of hoses and things that can go bad.
i hope i am wrong and this doesnt happen to you again. ans most importantly that i'm not behind you.. i wouldnt want your coolant on my squeaky clean windshield :cool:


best of luck with it and remember, if it makes you happy and you can spare the money dont feel too bad about it. went for a hard drive last night and forgot all about the 7000$ i spent a week ago on it.

CrisZenithBlue 07-21-2016 08:38 AM

also, needless to say i am not test driving friends Boxsters anymore.. :D

JFP in PA 07-21-2016 09:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MWS (Post 503884)
Quick update, soon as I hit "post", shop called. Apparently they pressure tested system and ran at temp, they say it is the coolant cap (apparently there have been revisions). I don't know if I accept answer, as when I added water, some poured out immediately underneath; granted, I spilled some, but appeared more leaked than was spilt. Also, my trunk carpet was totally dry.

Is it possible to loose that much coolant via cap within 30 min???

Yes, it is. Food for thought department: I would seriously consider replacing the cap and the tank while the car is apart for the IMS. Much like the AOS, changing the tank with the car assembled can be a knuckle skinning couple of hours; with the trans out, like the AOS, the tank connections are out in the open and the tank can be swapped out in a few min. Word of caution: Do not use an aftermarket tank. We have had zero luck with them, and now only install factory units.

MWS 07-21-2016 11:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Disaster (Post 503886)
So in about 1500 miles of driving you put over $7200 into repairs! :-O

Well, if you put it that way... Oh wait, that's only $4.80 / mi. Price for happiness? ;/

Tcar 07-21-2016 12:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Disaster (Post 503886)
So in about 1500 miles of driving you put over $7200 into repairs! :-O

It does seem odd that coolant wouldn't have gotten into the trunk if the cap was leaking.

There's a rubber dam around the filler that seals to the inside of the trunk lid and a drain.

geraintthomas 07-21-2016 03:38 PM

Same happened to me, but at a stand still. Emptied all of its coolant on a car park. I had the .01 revision cap, and the latest is .04. The seals crack on the older ones, air gets in, water gets out, and someone told me that the car can 'belch' to throw out the water to eradicate the air in the system on its own. Either way, it ends with a huge loss of coolant, whether you like it or not.

I replaced the cap, never had a problem since :)

Froggo 07-21-2016 04:12 PM

Yes you can lose a lot of coolant in a short space of time , it happened to me also . I was lucky i guess topped it up and bought a new blue cap 04 and now it's fine .

NewArt 07-21-2016 04:30 PM

I can assure you that a faulty cap can dump a s...load of coolant as quick as you can say it. Looks bad in the tech line at the track. ask me how I know :o

jdlmodelt 07-21-2016 05:55 PM

I bet your cap is not sealing and the coolant is leaking out the cap. It happened to me. scared the hell out of me. added two gallons and made sure the cap was screwed on properly and was terrified as I drove home 30 miles. watching the temp closely


Quote:

Originally Posted by MWS (Post 503878)
Here's a story of what you don't want to have happen...

I have a '01 2.7 with approximately 47,500 mi that I have owned for about 10 years. I have had the car stored for 3 years (maybe as little as 1000 mi since '10), and I should mention that the car had no issues when driven last. This spring I decided to start bringing the car back to life and after battery replacement, had multiple electrical gremlins which I resolved with the exception of the climate control, which I narrowed down to the climate control unit. The unit in question was replaced in 2008, so 8 years ago, but almost new. I could have purchased a used unit online and switched my face using the donor board, but since the fault that caused the failure of the board was unknown and fearing burning out another board, I decided (with the advice from this forum) to go the Porsche route and order a new unit and have them install at a cost of about $900.

Now here is where the "might as well" starts to come into play...

Never did the IMS, so I figured if in for $900 plus service I am at about maybe $1200, might as well do the IMS (using LN bearing) at Porsche cost of about $3000. Now estimate is at about $4200, so more "might as wells".... I trust my Porsche rep as we have a history going back over 15 years (we also have Audis), so I asked them to check RMS, AOS, belts etc, and change fuel filter, plugs, bla-bla. Basically, check everything, replace any needed item and keep bill $5000-ish. I also need tires (not too badly worn, just old), but asked them to check, and if needed I would have a set sent to them (they even advise it's cheaper for me to buy and have sent to them rather than buy from them, which is nice).

So yesterday morning I am driving to the dealership (about 60 mi) on a rural road when suddenly a convertible Corvette C7 flies up behind me, then fades way back. We reach a 4 lane road, and the 'vette comes along beside me and starts yelling something. I slow down to hear him, and apparently I am spraying liquid from the rear passenger wheel arch, I am pissed, but thank him to which re replied, "you got it all over my windshield, ****************************"), fine, whatever. I pull over to investigate, to find pink mist (obviously G12 coolant) sprayed from wheel arch. I check level via observation port on tank, shows about 3/4, cap is hot, but dash gauge is in the middle, no high temp light on. I proceed a couple miles to gas station and call service rep, he instructed to let car cool, and check level in tank visually via cap opening, add water if needed and proceed to shop (about 10 mi). When I opened cap, the level I saw on inspection window was a "ghost" and tank was actually empty. I added almost 2 gallons of straight water, some leaking underneath, but didn't just pour out. I proceeded to shop without further problems, but tank was empty at arrival. To clarify, temp on gauge never spiked, no temp light and most importantly, no sound or smell. Here is where I should mention about 900 mi ago I had a catastrophic coolant pump failure, which I had Porsche replace including new lines, total pressure flush (twice for piece of mind), almost a total coolant rebuild short of rads (which were flushed separately) at a total cost of about $2200. The unfortunate part is even thought the coolant system was done only 900 mi ago, it was in 2011.

I am waiting for update from shop.

Anyway, not a good day. Sorry for the length, I guess I wanted to vent to kind people who might understand. Feel free to offer opinions, or heck, laugh at me for throwing money down a hole. I guess I don't see my Boxster as just a machine, but there is some emotional attachment. When it makes me happy, I am very happy; other times (like now), I forgive it and remember... soon you will make me smile again.


MWS 07-22-2016 06:11 AM

Second update...
Porsche still believes it is only the overflow cap, but will pull and inspect tank when IMS is being done. New total is about $5500, but rep assures me that is maximum. List of what is being done:
IMS (and all direct related)
Clutch plate
New climate control
Fuel filter (ok, but my request)
Oil filter
Brakes (f&r), pads only reminds me, ask about fluid/flush
Plugs & 2 new leads (asked why only 2, said "wouldn't bother with other 4")...well, ok.
Change coolant
New coolant cap (latest rev)
Inspect tank (hoses are ok)
Catalytic converter threw a CE error, but seems ok, error cleared
Check a/c refrigerant, replace as necessary
Pull AOS to inspect (replacement extra)
Check EVERYTHING.
(I am looking at new tires or tire/rim upgrade, but separate post)

All things considered, I am pretty happy with cost and should restore car to top condition. Even for Porsche dealer service and all Porsche parts, this seem like a very reasonable price.

Any other "might as wells" people can think of would be greatly appreciated!

linderpat 07-22-2016 06:30 AM

Agreed, for all of the work listed, that estimate seems reasonable to me too. Good luck, hope that after you get it back, you have many many miles of no issues driving. These are great cars (I miss mine, for sure)

Disaster 07-22-2016 07:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MWS (Post 504040)
Second update...
Porsche still believes it is only the overflow cap, but will pull and inspect tank when IMS is being done. New total is about $5500, but rep assures me that is maximum. List of what is being done:
IMS (and all direct related)
Clutch plate
New climate control
Fuel filter (ok, but my request)
Oil filter
Brakes (f&r), pads only reminds me, ask about fluid/flush
Plugs & 2 new leads (asked why only 2, said "wouldn't bother with other 4")...well, ok.
Change coolant
New coolant cap (latest rev)
Inspect tank (hoses are ok)
Catalytic converter threw a CE error, but seems ok, error cleared
Check a/c refrigerant, replace as necessary
Pull AOS to inspect (replacement extra)
Check EVERYTHING.
(I am looking at new tires or tire/rim upgrade, but separate post)

All things considered, I am pretty happy with cost and should restore car to top condition. Even for Porsche dealer service and all Porsche parts, this seem like a very reasonable price.

Any other "might as wells" people can think of would be greatly appreciated!

If he is going to "pull the AOS to inspect" I'd probably have him put a new one in...especially if it is the original. They are a PITA to replace.

Is he replacing the flywheel and pressure plate too, or just the clutch disk? Normally you'd replace the entire set and the throwout bearing while you were in there, then grease.

Two new leads? Does this mean the coils? Are they bad?

Do you have a bad climate control screen? New screens are $60 bucks...and not difficult to replace.

How much life left on brake rotors? I always do them together since rotors aren't too expensive and they have a tendency, nowadays, not to make it through two pad changes.

P.S. $7,700 now. :-\

BruceH 07-22-2016 07:58 AM

Sounds like a reasonable price for all of the work. Definitely get the brake fluid flushed/replaced. I would agree on having a new AOS installed while you are at it. You may want to think about the water pump while they are in there.

Porsche9 07-22-2016 08:44 AM

Once all this work is done you need to get out and drive this car so you can enjoy it.

FauxDiablo 07-22-2016 09:13 AM

Low miles on a car that is 15 years old is no better than really high miles on a car that is one year old. They need to be driven.

Newer with high miles, you get wear and tear from the operation of the car. This is easy to deal with.

In an older car with low miles, you get rubber and plastic parts that deteriorate, get hard and become brittle. Non-serviceable oils and grease become hard. You WILL have minute traces of moisture in EVERYTHING, and it will leave it's mark as corrosion in some way, shape or form.

Sounds like your plastic trunk tank took a crap.

RandallNeighbour 07-22-2016 09:27 AM

You're in good company with throwing money at an occasionally driven sports car. I stopped counting dollars in after $30k for my 1997 Boxster, purchased for $15,500 in 2004 (all in I'm at 45k or more now),

Now I can't sell it or I will realize the loss. What's it worth on a good day, $8500?

I just gotta drive it until the 2nd motor blows or the tranny craps out and then pass it to someone as a roller and start saving up for the next sports car.

MWS 07-22-2016 11:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RandallNeighbour (Post 504075)
You're in good company with throwing money at an occasionally driven sports car. I stopped counting dollars in after $30k for my 1997 Boxster, purchased for $15,500 in 2004 (all in I'm at 45k or more now),

Now I can't sell it or I will realize the loss. What's it worth on a good day, $8500?

I just gotta drive it until the 2nd motor blows or the tranny craps out and then pass it to someone as a roller and start saving up for the next sports car.

Wow... This probably isn't a record amount, but it's definitely up there. At this point (if I were in your shoes) even if the most catastrophic thing happens, well, might as well...

:)


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