I'm not quite understanding the "TS wanted to scare or brush back KW" idea. TS had already dealt with KW when he put him in the wall. At that point, the deal was done. Taught him a lesson. Well forgotten. Nothing more to worry about. No reason whatsoever to do anything further.

What am I missing?

To me, it was more he knew KW had crashed and wanted to gloat - so he was a little higher on the track so he could make sure KW saw TS still in the race while KW was not. Again, I'm not in his head, so am only guessing, based on the little I know about TSs personality.
Knocking him out taught him a lesson - driving up high was to drive that lesson home.

I have watched the original video several times. I see TS high on the track, but he never moves to actually put KW into the wall. If KW had that tight of a lane, he could have backed off and taken the lane behind TS. He fought the top lane battle and touched the wall, seems his own doing.

Then the video at the top of previous page, slowed down, with arrows. TS never moved that car and it didn't make one motion until it hit KW and that was from him being under the wheel. High lane pass to gloat maybe, but nobody expected KS to be out of his car and running towards the lanes.

When the guy who "wrecked him" is also the guy who killed him, it's easy to draw these lines connecting the two, then throw some gas on it (TS bad attitude) and it's "TS will never race again" when in reality there is nowhere near enough evidence to show criminal liability. Civil?? Ask Porsche about the PW lawsuit.

As far as we know, all evidence is not in, all statements have not been taken, all equipment has not reviewed yet, etc. Also, the mere fact -- that during a caution -- he went higher and faster, opens the door to depraved indifference of human life investigation by local and state prosecutors, not including the police investigation. Once the prosecutors are looking at something closely.... all bets are off, it can go either way. I was pretty certain that this would absolutely lead to a prosecution (albeit with an unlikely conviction) simply because he's a high profile hot head that ran over someone who died.
Prosecutions are easily politicized, as we've seen in Florida numerous times. And juries a total crap shoot, I've seen plenty make some bizarre decisions.
in other words, the process is in motion and I would not be sleeping well at night if I were TS. Although that will probably continue if he's cleared of criminal negligence.

This hoax reporting that Tony Stewart was going to retire was posted online. If you see it, ignore it.

I fell for it and clicked through. Turns out that its a site that posts fake stories for laughs.

Worse than a Rick Astley video. :)

NASCAR: Tony Stewart To Announce Retirement From Auto Racing After Accident That Kills Competing Driver | Empire News

Geez...mixing up all that adrenalin, testosterone, HP, speed, and low visibility its amazing that this doesn't happen every race.

I think it caused poor judgement on both parties and the result although unexpected was probably inevitable eventually.
(That someone was going to get seriously injured during a race)


As a matter of fact I do come from the cold white north originally as do many others in the southern states. You can only take so much of the white stuff before you cave!:ah:

Didn't you know the the US is actually 15% populated by the funniest Canadians. Where did you think the US gets its polite people from? :D

Only problem integrating is the racial jokes, I found out that those don't fly well here at all and with all the guns around those jokes may not end well.

Shall I tell you the story of Nantuk and I?
Jim Carrey - Canada - YouTube

Here's my dad's take on it, he's a DE driver/instructor for AMG/Mercedes.

I see these accidents on the track all the time, then try to figure out why it happened. But I was not there to see this one so I can't say how it went. But we have to yell at newcomers all the time to stay in your car after any accident unless it is on fire. The safety gear in the car will protect you from harm, to get out of a car and stand on the track is beyond stupidity. No racer would ever run over some other racer on purpose. IMHO. :-)

He's got more track time then most of us on this forum, so figured his two cents would be interesting.

And, no, even he doesn't get to drive my car. :D

Canada does produce a lot of comedians/funny people. Let's face it, you have to have a sense of humour to put up with all this white stuff we get!

My apologies for going a bit off topic. Sorry.

He may not retire but the guy we once knew who grabbed Harvick's wife's butt right in front of Kevin, the guy raced in these sprint races hard like they were a NASCAR race, the guy who basically raced with fire in his belly (and brain) is definitely done. Which makes me wonder if he can race any other way. Can you imagine ever seeing Tony Stewart in another deliberate on-track wreck or brawl? tossing another helmet? I don't think the reaction would be good...
This all makes me think of former F1 driver Stefan Johansson after he killed (or was involved with however you look at it) Jeff Krosnoff and a track worker while attempting a pass at the end of the Toronto street race. Johansson was roughly the same age Stewart is now when those guys died. He entered a few sports car races but basically stayed behind the scenes as a team owner.

Nanook No NO!, don't be a naughty Eskimo

and of course, Don't eat yellow snow

The reason I clicked through to that fake story is that I thought that it sounded quite plausible for the very reasons that you mention. TS might retire after all, I guess we'll just have to wait and see.

No one wants to be the guy who let's TS off and no one wants to be the guy who charges TS with a crime.

Soooooooooo, let's have the Grand Jury decide, that way no one has to take a beating in the media.

Ts
 

First I should say that I have been to many dirt track races. As a crew member and a fan.
When a big time driver comes to a small town track it`s a big deal.Fans who normally don`t go to this track will come to see him or her not the rest of the field.
Anyway, there is an unwritten rule not to mess with him or her as the grandstand is full and they want to see him or her put on a show.Race them hard but .Respect. Kind of like the "Don`t hit Gretzky " rule.
That kid was racing Tony and knew he was inside of him. He also knew the Tony would try to make the pass. All the kid had to do was lift let him go and follow Tony into three. On a regular show night the kid would of and should of done what he did.But not that night. There were no extra points to beat Tony. I`m not saying let him win , not at all but this was a different show.The kid gambled and lost. Tony doesn`t and wasn`t going to lift.
Why did he get out ? Has he done this in the past ?
Tony knew there was a wreck but probably didn`t expect the kid to get that close.
Where were the safety crews ? Did Tony try to toss some dirt on him ? Did Ward`s inexperience get the best of him ? Youtube is full of videos of am drivers getting out of their cars and dukin` it out. Sometimes these things are " discussed " between the haulers after the race. Kid wasn`t going to do that. A career ender if he did. Unfortunate way to learn to stay in your GD car.

I saw an episode of Law & Order once, where the cops were talking to a doctor who was performing a procedure on a coma patient of the opposite sex. They asked him "aren't you supposed to have an extra person in the room for protection?" and the Dr replied "The extra person is here for *my* protection so I don't get falsely accused of anything, and I don't need it since this patient is in a coma". To me the rule of "Don't get out of the car on a hot track unless you are on fire" is kind of like that. Sadly, when Ward got out of the car, his life was potentially forfeit. When he ran over to Tony, and the unfortunate incident occurred, that would not have happened if he had stayed in the car. Now Tony is left behind and has to live with it and the possible consequences. Since Ward paid such a high price for his part of it, Tony is too 9even if not convicted having to live with it seems like a high penalty)

I also saw a video analysis that shows the right-rear of Tony's car dropping down, and it suggested that Ward hopped on to Tony's car and rode along for a short distance before falling off and getting run over. It showed a few blobs that purported to show Ward's hands and feet holding on to the car. Very blurry and hard to see but it is a theory I suppose.

Well only one of the two guys that know what actually happened is still alive.
It's kind of like the "stand your ground" law that way. Without clear as day video evidence the guy who lives through the confrontation has the overwhelming power of reasonable doubt behind him since he can spin the tale without another witness to contradict him.

Grand Jury:

No charges for Tony Stewart, Kevin Ward was under the influence of Marijuana.

Never saw THAT coming! :eek:

TO

Wow, that would explain the stupidity of wandering around on a live track. Can't believe no one noticed Ward was that high before the race and stopped his going out there.

High or THC in his system? Maybe he got high 3 weeks before the race...

just sayin':rolleyes:

The DA specified there was enough there to consider him "under the influence". What exactly that means I have no idea.

LOL. Do you know how many drivers in traffic around you are "high" on marijuana every single day?
And as someone who at point used to perform drug testing, aggressive or reckless behavior is not what's associated with THC. And that's if he even smoked it that day. And given how close he was racing a world class professional racing driver like Stewart, I HIGHLY doubt the kid was impaired at the time of the incident.


Man Tony Steward just caught the luckiest break of his life.
Did anyone test him for anything?

This was the expected outcome.

No toxicology test for Stewart. However, the police did have a certified drug recognition expert (what ever that is) interview him immediately after the race and that person found no basis for alcohol or drug impairment (and thus no test was performed).

Nascar drivers are subject to random tests every week and as their history reflects this is grounds for immediate suspension. As a team owner and drive this would be a double whammy. I doubt he be that defiant of the rules.

According to sources (DA), KW was impaired - meaning he was unable to make/use proper judgments, and this led directly to him making a very bad decision to walk out on the track. THC metabolizes very quickly - so if they found evidence of this, he was impaired. Not sure where you get the HIGHLY doubt then.
And your 'argument' about other drivers - does that somehow make it right? If you are impaired, you should not be driving. And whomever let KW get into that car should bear some responsibility. If you are a bartender, and you let someone leave your place and they get in an accident, you could be help liable.

If you are impaired you will not be driving in a race of this type, that requires constant corrections and focusing, against a completely unimpaired professional racing driver. Think about it... You can can't have it both ways.

My reference to other drivers in traffic is to point out that millions of marijuana smokers drive in traffic every single day of the calendar without a pandemic of marijuana driving accidents. Neither do the police perform random urine tests like they perform sobriety tests. In both situations there are quick and cheap devices that can confirm the presence of alcohol or THC. I know because I used to do these, in 5-10 minutes you have a result for cocaine, THC, heroin and probably ecstasy now. Despite years of study and testing no legislation has ever been passed for roadside tests for illicit drug use while driving nor have law enforcement pushed for this. My point isn't to be "pro marijuana legalization". It's to refute what seems like a pretty obvious effort to shift focus off of Stewart.

As to getting out of the car, that was more likely due to his age than the presence of marijuana. There's much research on the inability of young people to maintain rational, clear-minded thought at times of high emotion. It's a neurological development that does not finish until a young person is well into their 20's. There are also individuals with the so called "warrior" gene that pushes them towards danger and aggression during high emotion. THC provoking road rage where the person under this drug runs into traffic? Completely contradictory to what I saw on a daily basis.
We did have people get aggressive and violent, but those were usually cocaine and meth users.

Any random drug test can be beaten. See 1999 - 2005 for one Lance Armstrong during which he passed hundreds of drug tests performed by a multitude of multinational laboratories under supervision by various governing bodies.

You can't have it both ways either. You say there are people driving all over the place while high - but they don't get in accidents. But then you say the reason KW got out of his car is because of his age....but then if that were the case, we would have young kids causing all sorts of road rage then. Again, where I come from, it happens, but happens just as much with older drivers too.
The fact from what I can see is that KW was high. THC metabolizes very fast. If it still showed in his system at such a high amount, his judgment was impaired. Hence my point - someone should have stopped him. It appears someone dropped the ball here.
Yes, THC mellows you out - but that is still an impairment and does cause different results in different people. We've all seen alcoholics who are even more mellow when they drink and some who fly off the handle. Drugs react differently to different people.

He wasn't exactly smoking weed. That's not so easy to beat. Even a skinny daily smoker can test positive a month plus after the last toke. Trust me on this. (My son)

And as to his abilities while high, I'll say he absolutely could possibly race and compete after a hit or two. Depends on how it affects him and how regularly he used it. (Personal experience)

Unless they smelled it on his breath, a test could not tell if he got high that morning or at lunch or 15 minutes before the race as far as I know. Only a field sobriety test.

The decision to get out of the car was age and environment driven.

Yes but my point is that the inference that the decision to step out of the car and towards the approaching cars because of THC is tenuous at best. And that's if you can even establish that the high hadn't worn off at the time of the race. We also don't know how much THC would have been needed to impair his decision making as he could have been a chronic user with higher baselines.
Also, it could very well be that the THC reduced his anxiety and stress levels and allowed him focus better. Yes quiet the opposite of what we may be thinking. A recent German study not long ago concluded that THC was effective in treating ADHD.

There is no doubt there are dozens of questions we will never know the answer to. THC has many beneficial uses while at the same time can also cause poor judgment and/or impairment. We don't know how it affected KW. Did it affect his decision to get out of the car? Or was that age? Or possibly a combination of both?
All we have are our opinions, many based on personal experiences and personal bias. In this case, as we will never have the actual answer - none of us are right and none are wrong - but still fun to debate and talk about.

It needs to be said that there was a loss of life here. Also, someones pro career is now tainted. The Ward weed thing and Tony`s racetrack mindset can be debated till the cows come home. Thoughts and prayers have been given to the Ward family from fans around the world. Tony`s fans have also supported him.
Time to put this to rest and let both groups move on.

Just imagine the reaction and legal issues if Tony Stewart had been proven to be high when he hit the guy who was high and chose to walk into traffic on the racetrack. People do stupid things and stupid things (sad too) happen.