Sumitomo HTR Z III - 986 Forum - The Community for Porsche Boxster & Cayman Owners

blue2000s · 05-18-2009, 03:47 PM

I've read nothing but positive things about the Sumitomo HTR Z III. Does anyone with experience with them have any negative experiences or comments?

blinkwatt · 05-18-2009, 04:06 PM

Here is my experience............

Some of the best tires in non rain weather......death traps in rain. They seem very prone to hydroplaning. But Sacramento can get some nasty nasty rain and these are extreme tires so meh!

schnellman · 05-18-2009, 05:42 PM

Five thousand miles here and nothing but good to report. I don't drive the Boxster in the rain, so I can't comment on that.

ekam · 05-18-2009, 05:52 PM

None of the tires in this class act well on rain... that's a given.

FYI Sumitomo is the parent company of Dunlop and also part of Goodyear.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sumitomo_Rubber_Industries,_Ltd.

944boy · 05-18-2009, 06:09 PM

I have about 3K miles on my set. I am more than happy with them. Heavy northwest rains and I feel stable and safe at high speed (regular driving where the speed limit was 70, but i wasn't going that slow ;-) ). They stick well and are very predictable. They are not the absolute stickiest tire out there, but in my opinion very nice. Be wary of reviews... many people fail to realize the HTR Z III is FARRRRRR better than the previous 2 generations. The I and II were light years behind this tire.

They have worn very evenly and hardly even noticeably in the 2K since I put them on. My girlfriend is scheduled to take the car out on the track at a DE so we will see how they do there.

I would highly recommend them to anyone. They even look good, very pirelli like.

Just my .02

eightsandaces · 05-19-2009, 03:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by blue2000s

I've read nothing but positive things about the Sumitomo HTR Z III. Does anyone with experience with them have any negative experiences or comments?

Don't like them, IMO they flat spot too easily just sitting in the garage. although I have no experience with the III's. IMO, buying a performance car and being a cheap ass on tires makes no sense because the tires are a huge part of performance.

E Kaplan · 05-19-2009, 03:44 AM

Can't comment on the Sumitomo. Never drove on them. However, if you want a great tire that sticks and is good in the rain, get the NItto's.
Nitto NT555 Extreme ZR 225/40R18 $124 each, rear 265/35R18 $181 each
Great price for a great tire. I never heard of them, but when I purchased my Boxster the former owner had these put on. I liked them so much I put them on my Jaguar XJR and could not be happier.
Eric

blue2000s · 05-19-2009, 06:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by eightsandaces

IMO, buying a performance car and being a cheap ass on tires makes no sense because the tires are a huge part of performance.

I actually agree with you to a point. That point is where I'm sitting. With tires, as with most things, there is a phenomenon known as diminishing returns. In general, the more you pay, the higher quality you get on an item. This can be considered a linear relationship up to a point. At this point, it becomes much more expensive, either in design effort, or in materials, or some other property, to eek out just a bit more quality.

It's very common in racing bicycles. You can get a crumby, heavy road bike for $500. It'll get you into biking to see if you really like it, but it's not going to last long and it makes hills much harder than they need to be. You can get a pretty decent, long lasting bike for $1600. It'll probably need some repairs every once in a while and the materials are pretty pedestrian. You can get a really nice, really light road bike for $3000. This bike will last tens of thousands of miles and allow you to be competitive at most levels. It's got sleek components and made from exotic materials. But for someone who's livelihood or ego depends on it, a person can spend $12,000 and get a little lighter (like 1/2 pound MAYBE), little faster, and probably just as reliable bike.

The HTR Z III performs well against more costly competitors in tests, doesn't always come out on top, but doesn't scrape the bottom either. It's got a good temperature rating, and it's treadwear is almost double some of the more costly competitors. It comes from a well established manufacturer handled by well known retailers. So clearly this tire isn't of poor quality or lacking in performance.

I don't drive at a track and if I autocross, it is not often and not competitive with anyone but myself. It's actually more rewarding for me to have driven the car in the mountains for a couple of seasons and seeing that the wear bars are still pretty far away than to have the fasted track time or to have pulled that extra 0.1g of lateral acceleration and see that another year has cost another grand in a quickly consumed purchase.

In addition, I don't necessarily agree with the notion that the stickier a street tire is, the better. I like a sports car that will be fun to drive at less than suicide speeds. Tires that give away a little earlier just mean that the fun arrives a speeds that are less likely to kill you. Vintage cars are more fun to drive than modern ones partially for this reason.

So what seems like simply "being a cheap ass" to someone without the insight, is a logical decision for someone else.

944boy · 05-19-2009, 06:45 PM

I agree with Blue on this. I have a $1600 bike that has lasted many miles and many years, has been wonderful in every aspect. It won't win me any serious bike race, but that's not what I bought it for.

I have a 944 that I race competitively. Everything makes a difference. I can spend more on solid bushings than the car is worth. But that's what it takes to make a car competitive in some classes.

For the Boxster, I put a huge amounts of miles on the car and needed less expensive tires that would last a few miles with good rain performance. I didn't need the best of the best nor did I want to pay for it. But I didn't want a crappy tire, I've had plenty of those too. (Old Nittos NT-450?, Falken Ziex 512) I have been very happy with these tires and other people on this board have been too. I can't comment on flat spotting, the car rarely sits for more than 24 hours.

Ultimately I am not buying the tires for you, that is your decision. Almost any tire you can buy in the size you need will be round and made of rubber and work perfectly fine. You should match the tire with what you expect from it.

eightsandaces · 05-20-2009, 02:50 AM

I'm not castigating the choices of others, clearly everyone here appreciates their vehicles. All I'm saying is after reading volumes on fairly expensive upgrades in this forum I would think a tire purchase would certainly include a measurement of quality & performance. I agree with blue that highest price isn't always the best metric and diminishing returns and paying for names is a reality. My dad had one small problem with his sport pilots and Michelin was all over it! Having worked in the fortune 100 battlefield, I appreciate true customer service and product quality, not just lip service.

ChefCarnivore · 08-05-2009, 08:34 AM

The performance issue reminds me of equipment ads for skis, golf clubs, fishing gear , and sail boats. Namely, what's the use of paying more for performance equipment if you are not going to need it?

For many years skis were advertised as "racer" models when in reality most skiiers are recreational skiers and do not have the ability to get the performance out of the product because they are not physically capable and do not race. The same is true for the other categories mentioned above and for tires.

Quickurt · 08-25-2009, 06:57 AM

I came here looking for paying less than PS2's because, as I drive the car, usually with wifey in board I don't NEED PS2s.
I think Silver Bullet made the most sense a good while ago, to paraphrase, "If you'r enot doing track days or driving like you are but mainly use your car to cruise, why would you buy track quality, rediculously expensive PS2s?"
I want a set that will be safe when I need it, but will mainly not cost a dime a mile to use for cruising. Someone above also made the comment on the speeds needed to have fun with really sticky, high tech tires.
We switched to a required, much harder compound, Hoosier slick for Club Ford racing. Want to guess how much more fun they were to go 2 seconds a lap slower?

mptoledo · 08-25-2009, 08:51 AM

I started a thread and was giving an update as I broke them in. http://www.987forum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=21546

Got mine at local tire shop (tinity tires, urbana ohio) for $700 intstalled.

My take after about 700 miles is they were a great choice.

cons: Noisey, I do here/feel the road more than my Mich pilot sports. Nothing the stereo won't compensate for.
Handling is different from my Mich's, as they seem to over steer a little more.

Pros:Price, They handle very well, not a lot of rain testing but have been in a few showers, they seemed fine. Breaking was great, hard corners take a little extra effort as these are sticky tires.

conclusion: Great tires for people on a budget. I don't think they are as good as the more expensive tires, but they are close enough!! (for me at least). I don't track, I use them as a daily driver and back country, road rage!!

Quickurt · 08-25-2009, 09:08 AM

Thanks MP. I assume you're in Toledo. I was born in Sidney and lived in Piqua and Lima, also, before we moved to Miami in 1960! My dad owned some property on the south side of Toledo. I still have cousins and Aunt's and Uncles in and around Cincy.
Do you get together with Gregdacats in Newport, KY?
I think I'll try a set of the Sumi's. I had a couple of sets of the HTZ's on a couple of Preludes, years back now, but loved them on them.

mptoledo · 08-25-2009, 09:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Quickurt

Thanks MP. I assume you're in Toledo. I was born in Sidney and lived in Piqua and Lima, also, before we moved to Miami in 1960! My dad owned some property on the south side of Toledo. I still have cousins and Aunt's and Uncles in and around Cincy.
Do you get together with Gregdacats in Newport, KY?
I think I'll try a set of the Sumi's. I had a couple of sets of the HTZ's on a couple of Preludes, years back now, but loved them on them.

actually I moved from toledo (cause it sucks!! and I can prove it

) to Urbana ohio, between columbus and dayton. I would say if you don't have the $1300 laying around then definately go with the Sumitomo's. I have no regrets, but I have no idea what tread life will be like, but for almost half the price, I think its a no brainer for us budget minded people.

CA_Boxster · 09-07-2009, 12:52 AM

I have ~1000 miles on 17" HTRZ III's on my Boxster and I like them. It's difficult to compare directly to the last 2 sets of tires I had (PZeros and Goodyear F1 GS-D3) because I drove those tires to their absolute ends and new tires always feel a lot better when they go on. I'd say they are not noisy, they hold well and they give a good feel. I thought they seemed like they gave a little less road feel than the Goodyears at first but I think they were just "different" and I'm used to it now. The car is my daily driver but we won't have any rain until the Fall so I can't comment on wet traction. So far I'm glad I took the chance on a lower cost tire.

blue2000s · 09-07-2009, 05:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Quickurt

Someone above also made the comment on the speeds needed to have fun with really sticky, high tech tires.
We switched to a required, much harder compound, Hoosier slick for Club Ford racing. Want to guess how much more fun they were to go 2 seconds a lap slower?

I think I made my point pretty clear. If you care about lap times, lower cost tires probably aren't the right choice. If you like to feel a car's limits at a safe speed, lower adhesion brings out more personality.

blue2000s · 09-07-2009, 05:21 AM

Thanks for all the feedback folks. It definitely sounds like these tires aren't bad at all. I'm getting near the wear bars out back on my Contis. The car's season is over in a couple of months so I'll probably order a full set of these next spring.

ridetheworld · 09-07-2009, 01:03 PM

I just drove 800 miles from San Francisco to Tacoma, WA on a brand new set of HTR Z III. I hit a ton of rain on I-5 on the way home and the tires felt very safe and stable. I had zero hyrdo-planing issues until I hit some water that was about an inch deep. The car felt very stable and the tires provided great feedback in the rain. I would feel more confident on a rainy interstate on these over my 4runner with BFG A/T's any day of the week!

blinkwatt · 09-07-2009, 01:59 PM

Wow I'm starting to wonder if my alignment is really aggressive which is why I have soo many issues hydroplaning with these bad boys. But it also rains really hard here in Sac often,so I may have harsher conditions then most.

Other then that I still love them! I RAPED my car last night and I only got the tires to squeal when I punched it hard in the middle of a u-turn and they still didn't break loose.