Fabspeed bypass pipes
 

Hey guys what's the going price for Fabspeed 2nd cat bypass pipes?

-Steve

Steve, I bought mine off one of the forum classifieds for under $300 shipped, a couple of years ago; very slightly used (other than a little interior carbon), they looked new.

Look around, they can be found for less than list.

What's your opinion of them?

I've heard that it makes the car sound nicer and IMO that's good enough reason to get-em!

-SP

Even with stock headers in place? Thought you needed to change out both to get the full effect.

I think it's like what you experienced when desnorkling so it's an extension of that process, one more step in the louder growl direction!

I have checked all over and seems like 495 is about the lowest I've seen for the fabspeed ones.

I plan to get an oil change here in a month or so, but have been debating about atleast having these installed at the same time. NHP exhaust makes some too.

I think the pipes were worth getting (for me at least).

I'm back in this a couple days late, but bypass pipes are worth the money spent. I really think Porsche put these on to comply with EU noise restrictions...why else would anyone put secondary cats on a sports car?

The mid range tones are wonderful going to an all out scream as rpm rise. The nice part is tooling around town, it's not that much louder until you hit the throttle.

For any of the Chicago guys, I will be an instructor at the PCA autocross school next month and I will bring the Box S down so you can hear it in person...maybe I'll even get motivated enough to do some recordings to post. You can then draw your own opinions.

Ok, seems that most people like these. Now do you guys still have the stock headers in place with these on or you running different headers?

On a side note, please look at this recent update regarding Fabspeed products.

Fabspeed has a new video uploaded for the 986 S. They do an interesting test where they install hardware "adding one piece at a time" from exhaust, headers, BMC air filter, EVO intakek, and then finally, an ECU reflash.

Total cost - a whopping $4795

Total HP gains - 229 stock
241 w/ headers & sport cats
245 w/ BMC (good value - 4hp for about 100 bucks)
247 w/ EVO (not a good value whatsoever)
252 w/ ecu reflash and all above hardware installed

Total Gains - a whopping 23 hp
Total price per hp - just under 210 bucks each

See video here:

FYI - Turbowerx headers cost 800 and hp gains on a 986 S 3.2 motor is 22hp

Don't you guys find this interesting? Hell, I'll "splurge" and add a BMC filter too.

For 1500 bucks, I can have the headers, by-pass pipes, and the bmc while I take the rest and spend it on my family at a 5 star resort in the cayman's......

Why not just gut the stock pipes or have a muffler shop weld some up. It's not a complex exhaust piece. Seem crazy to pay $500 for 2 pieces of piping with one mandrel bend.

The though that crossed my mind is to get a set of worn out secondary cats from a dismantler for super-cheap, get rid of the "filling" in the cat, and now you have your low-cost bypass pipes...

You can gut the ones in your car in one afternoon. A long 1/2 drill bit, long chisel, hammer and a respirator. Back in 02 when the Subaru WRX came out, we all gutted the preturbo cat to get it to spool faster and because the facotry cat had a habbit of sending pieces of catalyst through the turbo, which is not a good thing.

I'll gut mine this weekend and let you know how it works out. If it's a success I'll post a DIY. If not I'll cry myself to sleep. :D

It works. Be careful about this as a DIY, though, unless it is explicitly for off road/racing vehicles! :D

I agree with the expense comment...$495 for a couple stainless pipes seems absurd. After listening, though, I feel they are well worth it. I think it would be difficult for a muffler shop to make up a couple of pipes unless the worker was a talented pipe bender?

I don't know about gutting the existing pipe, because you've introduced an odd shape in the middle of the exhaust route that would likely affect flow.

I've looked into building a set myself, and I've made a couple of unfortunate discoveries about why the price is so high. For starters, 4 to 5 foot pieces of straight stainless 2.25" tubing are about $50 delivered to your door. A pair of stainless header flanges are going to run $10 or so, making the raw materials cost around $100. The next hurdle is finding someone with a mandrel to bend the tubes correctly. Most exhaust shops don't have this...they've got a cheaper bender that puts the little wrinkles in the inner part of the bend. Anyone who's got a mandrel is going to be a real specialist, and their rates won't be cheap. I wouldn't imagine the labor to be under two hours to bend, cut, and weld both pipes. That's easily another $100+ . Put general retail markup on, and you're right at $450-500. Yeah, yeah, yeah, I'm sure Fabspeed sources the materials cheaper, and I'm also sure their welding dude isn't making $100/hr, but they also know their clientele and originally marketed the pipes to folks who paid new or near new for their cars.

Just to throw it out there, what would folks be willing to pay for a set of bypass pipes that WEREN"T stainless?

Jmatta, I'd love to connect with you in April to hear it before I pick up a pair.

Now I need to find a used pair...

not to rub it in but I had the incredible luck to pick up a pair of NEW fabspeed pipes on eBay for less than $250 (incl. shipping). So just keep looking and set up a "Saved Search" in eBay...

One weekend while I was visiting the parents in Fort Lauderdale, I drove around to about 10 different exhaust shops before finding one who would do exactly this for me.

I ended up finding a custom shop (with a mandrel bending machine), who made bypass pipes for me and installed them for $240. I even had him weld O2 bungs in them because my car is pre 03' and only had one pair of cats.

My suggestion if you're going this route is to spend an hour with your Yellow Pages and figure out a route (plan on making several stops before finding someone reputable who will get it done). When you get to each shop, talk directly to a Technician (preferably someone who is building a custom exhaust for some old muscle car! Offer to pay cash and not take a receipt, therefore any liability for removing cats is off their hands. If you go inside the office and speak to someone there, you are likely to be told that they will not do this for you.

Another FYI...I got a CEL shortly after leaving the shop because of the rear catalyst monitors (O2). I corrected this by purchasing (4) spark plug de-foulers, drilling out the bottom of (2) and threading them together. This takes the rear O2's out of the stream just enough to trick your DME into thinking that you have cats. It's been 1000 miles since, and no CEL.

In hindsight, I would probably go the route of high-flow cats rather than remove them completely. While the sound isn't obnoxious, it's also not too appealing either. Under normal driving conditions, and highway, it sounds pretty decent. If you floor it off the line, I think it sounds like crap personally. It sounds like something rattling in a tin can (from outside the car). Inside, the sound is smooth and without resonation. Maybe this is a personal preference, but I think a German sports car should have a nice throaty sound.

If you choose to go with high flow cats, I can tell you that I had pretty good luck with a pair I bought for my old Mustang some years ago off Ebay. I literally searched for the lowest price ones out there and was not disappointed.

Cheers!

The 2000 and newer Boxsters are Low Emissions Vehicle (LEV) certified -- not just in California, but all US-specification Boxsters. Presumably due to their (relatively) low sales volumes, Porsche certified all Boxsters to meet California emissions regs. So, that's why the 2000+ Boxsters have pre-cats in the exhaust manifolds and the main cats in the mid pipe.

My 2000 S recently developed a crack in the exhaust manifold where the pipe meets the flange at the cylinder head. It is hard to see, but a very close examination with a bright light reveals the crack on my car, specifically at the #6 cylinder. I suspect that other areas are cracked too, but I cannot see it. The symptom is a "tick" noise which is louder at startup and becomes quieter (but does not disappear) as the engine warms up. If you have ever heard a cracked exhaust header or a header that is just slightly leaking where it is bolted to the cylinder head, then you know the sound.

Therefore, I am looking at an inexpensive solution to this problem. Are the chinese headers (ebay) really of any benefit HP/Torque wise? If so, I could relocate the downstream O2 sensors behind the main catalysts and the car should still pass the cat efficiency monitor...avoiding the dreaded check engine lamp.

Well son of a gun, there's one on ebay now but it's for 03-06 and looks a little used...

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/03-06-Porsche-Cayenne-S-Cat-Bypass-Pipes-Fabspeed_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQ_trkparmsZ72Q3a1205Q7c6 6Q3a2Q7c65Q3a12Q7c39Q3a1Q7c240Q3a1318Q7c301Q3a1Q7c 293Q3a1Q7c294Q3a50QQ_trksidZp3286Q2ec0Q2em14QQhash Zitem220373740605QQitemZ220373740605QQptZMotorsQ5f CarQ5fTruckQ5fPartsQ5fAccessories#ebayphotohosting

o wait that's for a Cayene...

Hmmmm,

so I have two options:
a) replace 2nd ("main") cats with bypass pipes
b) replace pre-cats + headers with "hi-flow" headers w/o cats and relocate O2 sensor behind main cat

In your opinion which scenario has a higher chance to pass smog in CA?
Please note that I already went with option a :D

That's a good question. I bought my car in Jan 2009, and as such the prior owner had it smogged at a "corner garage" in Carlsbad...so I haven't seen a Boxster in the process of being smogged. I think that passing smog would depend on two factors:

1. The experience and work ethic of the smog inspector: If the inspector really knows Boxsters, then they will notice that your 2000+ Boxster only has the pre-cats but not the main cats. The VECI label inside the rear trunk mentions only that the car has 3-way catalysts, but it does not list how many. I have asked several techs and they tell me that the smog computer also does not list how many cats are supposed to be on the car. The main cats are much easier to see (vs the pre-cats) when bending down and looking under the rear of the car while it is parked. However, the pre-cats can be clearly seen when looking at the bottom of the engine, peeking in front of the rear wheels. Since many late-model cars have close-coupled cats (built into the exhaust manifold), I imagine that the bypass pipes would not look suspicious on a 2000+ Boxster as long as the pipes look stock. That presumes an inspector that doesn't know Boxsters well...

2. The composition of the pre-cats: I do not know for sure, but I suspect that the pre-cats are an oxidation "light-off" type of catalyst. If that is true, then there is a risk that your car might not pass the sniffer test - possibly failing due to excessive NOx. This could happen because (I think) the main cats are the 3-way type that oxidizes (burns) HC to produce CO2 & H2O, combines CO with O2 to make CO2 and reduces NOx to N2 and O2. I suspect that the engine management system (DME) controls HC and CO pretty well, but that good NOx control at light load would rely heavily on a properly functioning 3-way cat. For more detail on 3-way catalyst operation, check this out:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Catalytic_converter

Please let us know what happens when you go in for a smog check!

Thankfully, we don't deal with any of this in Illinois. Our emissions check is simply looking for fault codes in the OBDII system; if none exist, you pass.

I installed a set from Stebro on my 2000 S last year.

They cost less than Fabspeed's and they were easy to install.

The exhaust sounds better and the car seem to have gained some power.

The only downside is, if the engine is not fully warmed up, the exhaust will make some popping/backfire sounding types of noises when the throttle is lightly blipped coming off of idle. Not a big deal though...

Here's a photo that shows the test pipes laying next to the secondary cats.

Those are not mandrel bent pipes, which explains why they cost less.

What was the price of the Stebro and where did you buy it?

-Steve

Looking at the pics, I notice the Fabspeed pipes are larger in diameter. I'll have to measure mine when I have a moment.

I'm out of town on business right now, so I don't have the receipt handy.

I think they were around $300 something and I bought them directly from Stebro in Canada.

www.stebro.net

PS: Their service can be notoriously bad. I had to call several times to find out when the pipes were going to ship, before I got them.

"Total cost - a whopping $4795

Total HP gains - 229 stock
241 w/ headers & sport cats
245 w/ BMC (good value - 4hp for about 100 bucks)
247 w/ EVO (not a good value whatsoever)
252 w/ ecu reflash and all above hardware installed

Total Gains - a whopping 23 hp
Total price per hp - just under 210 bucks each"


Hey, thats quite a deal, my intake, chip and full exhaust ended costing around 7K and gave almost exaxtly the HP increase of the system above. That means it cost me over 300 bucks/hp, yikes. Nobody has ever accused me of being especially clever, but I am having a pretty good time....

Ed

:dance:

here are some of the Fabspeed pipes on the car...they are larger diameter than the Stebro ones.

MTS, your picture is far better than mine. I could tell right away the Stebro's were a smaller diameter than the Fabspeed's.